Just 1% of people are responsible for half of all toxic emissions from flying.

  • Kecessa
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    1 year ago

    You don’t understand what I’m saying.

    People shouldn’t be flying so dang much, it’s that simple. It’s not normal to expect to take one week off work and to be able to spend it guilt free on the other side of the world. I’m talking about eliminating commercial flights not to replace them with private jets, but to replace them with local vacations and with the expectation that if you decide to move across the continent you won’t be seeing your family four times a year but once every four years.

    Our incredible mobility is an unsustainable anomaly in human’s history.

    • Zoolander@lemmy.world
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      1 year ago

      Why?

      You can’t just make a claim like “people shouldn’t fly as much” without a reason why or claims like “mobility is an unsustainable” without any kind of evidence. Our mobility is 100% sustainable. Not only that, it’s sustainable in its current form.

      • Kecessa
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        1 year ago

        What? What you’re saying doesn’t make sense, your previous message you were saying so yourself, 5.3% of all CO2 emissions, 70% of that coming from commercial passenger flights!

        It’s. Not. Sustainable.

        • Zoolander@lemmy.world
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          1 year ago

          I think you’re not understanding the numbers. 70% of 5.3% of total emissions is 3.7% of total global emissions. In other words, if you eliminated all commercial flights, you’d only remove 3.7% of the total emissions being produced in the world. There are more impactful changes that can be made that do not have the impact of “no one can ever fly anywhere and you won’t see your family for years”.

          It is sustainable.

          🙄

          • Kecessa
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            1 year ago

            No, it’s not. With your attitude we can justify not intervening to reduce emissions in any sector because all of them taken individually don’t represent that much emissions.

            • Zoolander@lemmy.world
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              1 year ago

              Fossil fuel use in non-aviation transportation makes up almost 26% of the CO2 emissions globally. Don’t be ridiculous. I have said multiple times that there are much more impactful ways to make a big dent in CO2 emissions that don’t require people to live isolated from their families. You’re being dishonest.

              • Kecessa
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                1 year ago

                And planes aren’t as efficient as cars for the same mileage traveled and people use then to travel longer distances than they would if they went on vacation by car. Even better if trains as an alternative.

                As far as emissions are concerned, planes are the worst to transport both people and goods and should be limited to what is absolutely necessary.

                • Zoolander@lemmy.world
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                  1 year ago

                  planes aren’t as efficient as cars for the same mileage traveled

                  Again, that’s not true unless you’re talking about short distances for which plane travel is not even practical. A plane can carry up to 800 passengers to a destination. It would take 200 cars minimum to move the same number of people and their output would be nearly triple that of a plane. Cars use the same amount of fuel to move, start, and stop. Planes use most of their fuel use on takeoff and landing since they’re essentially gliders once in the air.

                  planes are the worst to transport both people and goods

                  Citation needed. You can’t just make claims like that without any kind of evidence considering that the statement is flat out not true.

                  https://ourworldindata.org/ghg-emissions-by-sector

                  Automotive transport makes up 12% of emissions - 4x that of airline travel.

                  • Kecessa
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                    1 year ago

                    Airplanes have a consumption equivalent of 3.5L/100km/passenger. A car with two passengers is equal to that, more passengers and cars win. Take more than CO2 into consideration? Looks even worse for planes as they don’t have an equivalent to a catalytic converter. Is 8.5T kilometers enough data?

                    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fuel_economy_in_aircraft

                    How about if we take contrails into consideration?

                    https://www.science.org/content/article/aviation-s-dirty-secret-airplane-contrails-are-surprisingly-potent-cause-global-warming

                    A 2011 study suggests that the net effect of these contrail clouds contributes more to atmospheric warming than all the carbon dioxide (CO2) produced by planes since the dawn of aviation.

                    Man, that sure doesn’t look good for airplanes does it? Imagine if we started talking about leaded fuel still used for piston engines (but let’s not go there…)

                    https://tedb.ornl.gov/data/

                    The same amount of cargo can be transported much more efficiently by rail or by boat.

                    But hey, you’re just proving my original point right, “regular people” who travel by plane don’t want to be told that they too are part of the issue and that they should feel bad about their choice. Guess it’s too hard for you guys to imagine living like the majority of the world’s population that will never take a plane in their lifetime and that won’t be visiting anything past a few hundred kilometers away from where they live… Oh the agony! Right?

                    It’s funny cuz you don’t even realize that traveling by plane means you’re already part of an elite when looking at it on a global scale.

      • vivadanang@lemm.ee
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        1 year ago

        Our mobility is 100% sustainable. Not only that, it’s sustainable in its current form.

        Oh the ice sheets on your planet are fine huh?

        JFC

        • Zoolander@lemmy.world
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          1 year ago

          Oh is the current state of the ice sheets because of the 3% of CO2 from airlines? Or maybe there are bigger contributors to what’s going on there that we can tackle first?

          Idiot.

          • vivadanang@lemm.ee
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            1 year ago

            I can’t decide which is more depressing, you fighting for people to have the right to keep polluting by flying around their own jets, or the fact that you’ll never even benefit from your campaign to defend the rich assholes fucking up our environment for their own convinience.

            either way you’re a sad, dumb sack of trash.

            • Zoolander@lemmy.world
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              1 year ago

              I can’t help it if you’re wrong. I’m not defending rich people, I’m just stating a fact. Planes are more fuel efficient than cars and there are more cars with less fuel efficiency. If you want to help the problem, planes are farther down the list of impacts than cars.

              http://websites.umich.edu/~umtriswt/PDF/UMTRI-2014-2_Abstract_English.pdf

              “A new report from the University of Michigan’s Transportation Research Institute shows that flying has become 74% more efficient per passenger since 1970 while driving gained only 17% efficiency per passenger. In fact, the average plane trip has been more fuel efficient than the average car trip since as far back as 2000, according to their calculations.”

              The report is called “Making Driving less Energy Intensive than Flying”.

              What’s depressing is that you’re so confidently incorrect yet continue to argue.