I’ve been led to believe that at least here in California, a fair number of ebikes come from online, as opposed to bike shops. Part of that is due to the relative low uptake of bicycling as transportation in much of the country outside of denser metropolitan areas on average, but the other aspect is that whereas I imagine bike shops in Europe are fairly standalone, small businesses, a number of shops here are chains created from decades of consolidation to cut costs. The result is that these chains might only support a handful of bicycle brands, and usually fewer ebike brands; we do have shops specific to Trek, Cannondale, etc but they’re not clustered near each other at all, often being in different cities. For acoustic road bikes specifically though, bike shops work fine to serve the wealthier clientele.
With that background, I think the situation for acoustic and electric bicycles have diverged. Acoustic bikes are very prevalent in the used market, and extremely cheap, “bicycle shaped objects” are available at Walmart. But ebikes have not reached that stage, and so ebike riders are often enthusiasts willing to buy online for substantially cheaper and shipped to them for free, or are the lucky few who have a broad selection of ebikes at their local bike shop. I wouldn’t regard these two demographics as particularly wealthy; I imagine very wealthy people would likely still be driving cars, for the speed and personal convenience.
As for cars, at least in California, they’re commonly viewed as “one of the few cheap things” in this high cost-of-living state. But that perception might be due to poor math, since the cost of insurance and registration, car payments or depreciation, and fuel ads up to somewhere between $5k-$10k per year. As a related tangent, I’ve heard anecdotes that EV sales in California are held back by a misconception that EVs cost more to run than ICE cars, despite a clear showing that our higher electricity costs are outweighed by the much lower maintenance costs. This showcases that people might have cars and simply be unaware of their true costs, which would tend to wrongly make cargo ebikes look expensive.
I proffer this video that touches upon the economics of a cargo ebike in North America replacing an automobile: https://youtu.be/QAON32yr7G0
EU pedelecs are limited to 250W and 25 km/h, and then up to 45 km/h for which you need a helmet, a license plate and a driving license.
Would both types be called pedelecs, or do they distinguish the latter with its own name or category? I can understand the helmet requirement, and maybe even an auto/motorbike license, but what is the purpose of the license plate? Do the 45 kph pedelecs pay some form of registration fees? This starts to seems very similar to what a small 49cc moped/scooter/motorbike would require, is that right?
EDIT: I do appreciate this exchange and all the Europe-specific information. I’m learning a lot and I hope I’m not bombarding you with too many questions
Well, I guess we can go on forever here, but I think the differences between the EU and the US are too many to find a simple explanation. Wealth distribution, population density, regulations, and so on.
I imagine bike shops in Europe are fairly standalone, small businesses
It’s a little bit of everything, tbf. There is a lot of independent local businesses here, for sure, and even in small cities you will find one. But you’ll also find the same few brands everywhere. We do have larger manufacturers who own several brands, so if you buy brand X or Y – it’s the same company. You have companies like Cube (I think they’re popular in the US as well) who run their own flagship stores, and Rose, who dominate online. But even those are mostly owner-managed companies.
I imagine very wealthy people would likely still be driving cars, for the speed and personal convenience.
Well sure, wealthy people here also have a car, they might just replace one car with a cargo bike. What I meant is, in the US even if you’re poor, the car is the last thing you’re going to give up. For example the thought of living in your car is absolutely alien to me, but I’ve heard this quite often as an argument from Americans why making fuel more expensive would be classicist. In the US, losing your car is often more devastating than losing your house.
Would both types be called pedelecs,
The speedier ones are called S-Pedelecs, Speed Pedelecs. And yes, they’re pretty much like a 50 ccm scooter, and the license needed is not a full auto license, it’s the same 16 y old get for their scooter.
but what is the purpose of the license plate?
I don’t know, I’ve never owned one or a moped, but it’s the same plate a moped would get, it’s some kind of insurance/tax thing I think.
I’ve been led to believe that at least here in California, a fair number of ebikes come from online, as opposed to bike shops. Part of that is due to the relative low uptake of bicycling as transportation in much of the country outside of denser metropolitan areas on average, but the other aspect is that whereas I imagine bike shops in Europe are fairly standalone, small businesses, a number of shops here are chains created from decades of consolidation to cut costs. The result is that these chains might only support a handful of bicycle brands, and usually fewer ebike brands; we do have shops specific to Trek, Cannondale, etc but they’re not clustered near each other at all, often being in different cities. For acoustic road bikes specifically though, bike shops work fine to serve the wealthier clientele.
With that background, I think the situation for acoustic and electric bicycles have diverged. Acoustic bikes are very prevalent in the used market, and extremely cheap, “bicycle shaped objects” are available at Walmart. But ebikes have not reached that stage, and so ebike riders are often enthusiasts willing to buy online for substantially cheaper and shipped to them for free, or are the lucky few who have a broad selection of ebikes at their local bike shop. I wouldn’t regard these two demographics as particularly wealthy; I imagine very wealthy people would likely still be driving cars, for the speed and personal convenience.
As for cars, at least in California, they’re commonly viewed as “one of the few cheap things” in this high cost-of-living state. But that perception might be due to poor math, since the cost of insurance and registration, car payments or depreciation, and fuel ads up to somewhere between $5k-$10k per year. As a related tangent, I’ve heard anecdotes that EV sales in California are held back by a misconception that EVs cost more to run than ICE cars, despite a clear showing that our higher electricity costs are outweighed by the much lower maintenance costs. This showcases that people might have cars and simply be unaware of their true costs, which would tend to wrongly make cargo ebikes look expensive.
I proffer this video that touches upon the economics of a cargo ebike in North America replacing an automobile: https://youtu.be/QAON32yr7G0
Would both types be called pedelecs, or do they distinguish the latter with its own name or category? I can understand the helmet requirement, and maybe even an auto/motorbike license, but what is the purpose of the license plate? Do the 45 kph pedelecs pay some form of registration fees? This starts to seems very similar to what a small 49cc moped/scooter/motorbike would require, is that right?
EDIT: I do appreciate this exchange and all the Europe-specific information. I’m learning a lot and I hope I’m not bombarding you with too many questions
Well, I guess we can go on forever here, but I think the differences between the EU and the US are too many to find a simple explanation. Wealth distribution, population density, regulations, and so on.
It’s a little bit of everything, tbf. There is a lot of independent local businesses here, for sure, and even in small cities you will find one. But you’ll also find the same few brands everywhere. We do have larger manufacturers who own several brands, so if you buy brand X or Y – it’s the same company. You have companies like Cube (I think they’re popular in the US as well) who run their own flagship stores, and Rose, who dominate online. But even those are mostly owner-managed companies.
Well sure, wealthy people here also have a car, they might just replace one car with a cargo bike. What I meant is, in the US even if you’re poor, the car is the last thing you’re going to give up. For example the thought of living in your car is absolutely alien to me, but I’ve heard this quite often as an argument from Americans why making fuel more expensive would be classicist. In the US, losing your car is often more devastating than losing your house.
The speedier ones are called S-Pedelecs, Speed Pedelecs. And yes, they’re pretty much like a 50 ccm scooter, and the license needed is not a full auto license, it’s the same 16 y old get for their scooter.
I don’t know, I’ve never owned one or a moped, but it’s the same plate a moped would get, it’s some kind of insurance/tax thing I think.