• Ænima@lemm.ee
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              1 year ago

              How else can they tell you about all the great deals and live streams they’ve been paid to promote? Won’t anyone think of the ads?!?!

              Ps, Blizzard did the same shit with their battle.net client when they removed the ability to pop out the friends list like 3 years ago (or centuries, it feels like), forcing you to use the client just to communicate with friends. All so they could blast you with advertisements to other services they provide.

      • schmidtster@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        Funnily enough, you probably own plenty already, and that attitude will change as soon as there’s a game in your wheelhouse you want.

        Everyone always says this, but it’s hardly every true. Too lazy too go through your comments to see if it’s true, but people say shit just for upvotes all the time. Probably the same here.

        • HTTP_404_NotFound@lemmyonline.com
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          1 year ago

          that attitude will change as soon as there’s a game in your wheelhouse you want.

          Oddly enough, I have managed to avoid DRM-infested games quite well so far.

          I have far to many other games on my list I still need to play without DRM, to worry about new ones infested with it.

        • El Barto@lemmy.world
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          1 year ago

          I’ve been doing well with offline games so far. Personally, I think that there are so many, so, so, so, so, so many games out there, both free and paid, that obsessing over “that one game” makes little sense to me.

        • priapus
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          1 year ago

          Or they might just pirate the games that do that. Save money and play offline all you want.

        • Draconic NEO@lemmy.world
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          1 year ago

          How very bold and presumptuous of you to dismiss almost everyone here claiming they prefer not to buy buggy DRM ridfled games as liars.

          Judging by your history though it’s not exactly surprising to say the least.

          • schmidtster@lemmy.world
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            1 year ago

            Lmfao, I specified one person.

            And that’s rich coming from the person upvoting their own comments in a 3 day old post that’s dead….

            • Draconic NEO@lemmy.world
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              1 year ago

              Everyone always says this, but it’s hardly every true.

              Your use of “everyone” in this context seems to imply a broad generalization including more than one person.

              And that’s rich coming from the person upvoting their own comments in a 3 day old post that’s dead….

              Ooh baseless accusations, gotta love those, perfect thing to whip out when your arguments are weak and someone’s calling you on it. Doesn’t surprise me in the least darling. Also it’s quite rich coming from someone who posts the same post five times in multiple communities rather than using the cross-post function, a tactic commonly used by vote and post-count farmers, really not a good look on you bud.

              • schmidtster@lemmy.world
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                1 year ago

                Uhh my app doesn’t have the function and I’ve explained that multiple times in my comments you went through!

                Everyone can be used to refer to singular or multiple! TYL.

    • circuitfarmer@lemmy.sdf.org
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      1 year ago

      Yeah, the implication that it didn’t run before by the headline is strange. Denuvo is officially supported in Proton.

      • Zeth0s@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        It keeps trying to connect to Bethesda servers… Slowing down the level loads

    • vividspecter@lemm.eeOP
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      1 year ago

      Agreed, but that’s a big benefit on the Deck. Unless Eternal has some additional always-online requirement (and maybe it does).

      • Zeth0s@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        It keep always trying to connect to the Bethesda servers, unless sd is set as airplane mode. It is annoying

  • beefcat@lemmy.world
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    1 year ago

    It already played great on the Deck (Denuvo hasn’t been a problem for Wine/Proton for several years), but the removal of DRM is always a win in my book.

    I’d like to see this trend of publishers stripping it out of their games after a couple years continue.

    • lud@lemm.ee
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      1 year ago

      I am pretty sure that when Denovo pricing leaked a while ago, we learned that keeping Denovo in a game is way more expensive the longer you keep it (yes, it’s basically a subscription service for game publishers)

      Denovo is really only designed for early sales, and it accomplishes that pretty well.

    • pinchcramp@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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      Why wait a few years and not avoid it completely? I doubt there’s any reliable data that confirms a significant loss in sales if they launched without Denuvo and its ilk. DRM is at best useless and at worst “harms” customers.

      • gila@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        You can’t really measure the proportion of players that would buy the game were they not able to pirate it, which makes it easy for CEOs to imagine every incidence of piracy as a lost sale. Who’s going to convince them they put the cart before the horse? It absolves them of direct responsibility for almost any shortcoming possible

        • dustyData@lemmy.world
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          1 year ago

          Essentially, it’s probably some manufactured guesstimated metric that some sales executives pulls out of his ass for each release.

      • beefcat@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        I doubt there’s any reliable data that confirms a significant loss in sales if they launched without Denuvo and its ilk.

        There’s no publicly available hard data one way or the other. However the fact that publishers continue to use it while abandoning other forms of DRM suggests that there is probably some benefit.

        I don’t really buy the argument that the only people who pirate content are people who would never pay for it to begin with. I know too many fellow software engineers that make comfy 6-figure salaries and pirate everything they can and spend money when it’s the only option.

        • thesilverpig@lemmy.world
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          1 year ago

          There is definitely a benifit, it just doesn’t necessarily have to be for the bottom line. If you are running a major publisher you are likely spending public shareholders money or executive partners money (with some skin in the game yourself) on these games.

          At the very least based on the consistency some publishers use Drm we know getting Drm buys piece of mind/job security that whoever is managing the project is doing something to prevent shrink/theft.

          It’s like the ad line goes, nobody ever gets fired for buying an IBM.

          There is safety in doing the best practice or industry standard.

          That all said, it’s entirely possible there is hard data out there that strongly suggests there is a cost benifit too it, and it’s just not public data.

        • pinchcramp@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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          1 year ago

          … there is probably some benefit.

          I was not thinking about the business side but rather about what the customer gets out of it. What bothers me about DRM systems is that they cause problems that you don’t have with pirated game, which is the opposite of how it should be. I don’t want to struggle to get a game running, when the pirated version does not caus those problems. That being said, I haven’t bought any large AAA title in years and my experience is from 7+ years ago. Maybe things have changed but I kinda doubt it.

          • beefcat@lemmy.world
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            1 year ago

            I think this is why Denuvo has been successful. Where old DRM solutions got up in your face with onerous installation procedures, installing borderline rootkits, and ridiculous activation limits, Denuvo is essentially invisible to the end-user. It’s not ideal, but if developers are going to insist on shipping DRM I’ll take this over what we used to deal with any day of the week.

      • ram@feddit.nl
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        1 year ago

        I’d be surprised if there WASN’T reliable data that confirms a significant loss in sales if they launched without Denuvo.

        • Draconic NEO@lemmy.world
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          I don’t think that astroturfers claiming to be pirates who “gave in and bought the game because of the DRM” is what people have in mind when they say reliable data.

          Sure I don’t deny that those people actually exist but I do also know that there is an incentive to push that narrative because they are spending money or time (in the case of In-House DRM) on implementing these measures so they got to make it seem as worthwhile as possible (especially in the case of publicly traded companies with shareholders).

  • corytheboyd@kbin.social
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    I feel like this is just a new cash grab technique, and it’s actually pretty smart. The audience of people who will buy immediately despite DRM will do their thing, first wave of money complete. Over the next few years, trickle in more cash through steam sales. Once that well dries, get one more wave of cash by removing DRM, which appeases the audience that abstained the whole time, collecting their cash.

    Edit: my half baked conspiracy theory got some attention. the argument that companies remove DRM like Denuvo because of cost makes way more sense, Occam’s razor holds true. Both can be true, they save money by removing the DRM, which has the nice side-effect of creating a small new wave of sales. Win/win. I’m sure Denuvo hates this and will one day make it more difficult for studios to just remove their software, because money.

    • GreenMario@lemm.ee
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      1 year ago

      I heard Denovo is a subscription so eventually it’s less cost effective to keep paying for it

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      Sorry but that doesn’t really make sense. In that scenario it is more sensible to just release a DRM free game at start, because the first group would buy either way and the second group would buy at the higher launch/near-launch pricing (since games drop in prices over time). It doesn’t make sense to make essentially 2 versions of the game over such a span of time like you described.

      A more realistic scenario would be that there is some cost / licensing fee to use Denuvo tech and it no longer makes financial sense for Doom Eternal to do so, hence BOOM! DRM free.

      • corytheboyd@kbin.social
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        Well, the intent behind adding DRM at first is to maximize profit by making piracy more difficult. Trust me I hate DRM too, but it’s not like they add it for no reason.

        • habanhero@lemmy.ca
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          1 year ago

          but it’s not like they add it for no reason.

          I didn’t say anything about that. I’m saying the main reason Bethesda removed Denuvo from Doom Eternal is likely because of cost reasons, not because it’s a marketing play to drive sales (like OP suggested).

        • Draconic NEO@lemmy.world
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          That’s the intent behind it, how well does it actually work in that front well it’s tough to say. Fact of the matter is I know this from hanging out in these communities people who aren’t willing to pay for the game but still play it usually aren’t willing to pay for it just to play it.

          The actual amount of people who “give in” is tough to estimate, because many people who do it are either astroturfing or are pretending, and most of the people who do “give in” typically will keep quiet about it, it’s not in their best interest to Brand themselves as a shill to other pirates.

          So the legitimate people almost never speak up about doing this, and most of the people who speak up aren’t really doing this either. So it’s hard to say just how much the DRM actually curbs it, and since the companies and their shareholders are paying for it they would probably want to imagine that number to be as high as possible because if it isn’t they really are paying for it for nothing more than an imagined benefit.

    • brognak@lemm.ee
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      1 year ago

      Pretty sure that’s literally Denuvos pitch. They don’t expect it to be uncracked forever, just last long enough to maximize initial sales and then eventually remove it when it’s done its job. It’s like a padlock on a bike, keeps honest people honest but won’t actually stop a real thief.

      • Takatakatakatakatak@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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        1 year ago

        Doom eternal was cracked on day one of release. I believe in this instance, they “accidentally” pushed an update with an unprotected version.

        When your game is as good as this one was, piracy can actually help to move more retail units.ID software and Bethesda know this better than most.

        It only hurts sales when your product is trash.

          • Takatakatakatakatak@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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            1 year ago

            Dude, I literally played the pirated version for a weekend and then bought Doom eternal because it was so damn good. I do it all the time. It’s in my steam library and I finished it twice and bought 2 expansion packs for it.

            I will now also download version 6.66 + All DLC’s from a pirated source for safe keeping to avoid any future fuckery via online services shutting down etc.

            This is not uncommon behaviour at all. Many games are absolute trash these days even when the tech press gushes over them. In spite of your assertions, demos are almost a thing of the past. Hardly anyone does demos anymore.

            My personal experience with chasing a refund after purchase does not reflect your experience either. Until critical mass builds into a full public backlash, if you’ve exceeded the return period (mere hours) then you are done.

  • tabular@lemmy.world
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    1 year ago

    Good to hear Denuvo being removed but overall bad that it was ever included. If I’m ever looking for more DOOM 2016 then I know it exists.

    • jerb@lemmy.croc.pw
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      You’ll be disappointed if you’re looking for “more DOOM 2016”- Eternal is a different beast entirely. Feels much more like a realtime first person puzzle game than a mindless arena shooter. Knowing enemy weak points and what guns do the most damage to that specific enemy + micromanaging ammo, health and armor is a BIG part of Eternal’s gameplay loop. It’s very good, but it’s quite far removed from 2016 in terms of gameplay.

  • AdmiralShat@programming.dev
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    Considering that this shitty DRM doesn’t actually stop the game from being pirated, why even bother doing it?

    • deczzz@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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      Some guy had success selling the idea that it does stop pirating to someone in management or something.

    • butiloveu@feddit.de
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      Because the sales in the first weeks matters the most. A lot of people always want the latest things either for free or in the worst case, they will have to pay . Denuvo has shown that the anti piracy mechanism are effective enough to stop a working cracked version to appear at day one or two. In some cases it took people 2 to 4 days to release a working version without Denuvo. So its an easy gamble for publisher to release a version with Denuvo. https://www.makeuseof.com/what-is-denuvo/

      • ram@feddit.nl
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        In some cases it took people 2 to 4 days to release a working version without Denuvo

        2 to 4 days? How about months and counting? Not to mention many Denuvo protected games are only playable through Switch emulation, something that might end soon.

        • butiloveu@feddit.de
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          Oh, I didn’t know it was this bad. But I already heard that Nintendo wants to start to work with Denuvo. Which will take a toll on the already outdated hardware. Not to mention that you probably wouldn’t be able to play Nintendo exclusives with 60 fps or more on PC anymore.

          https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2023/07/denuvo-wants-to-convince-you-its-drm-isnt-evil/

          Of the 127 Denuvo-protected games released since 2020, only half have had their DRM protection successfully cracked, according to a list maintained by the Crackwatch subreddit (this includes some games that officially removed Denuvo after being cracked). And among the half that have been cracked, the median title received a full 175 days of effective DRM before a crack was released, according to that same list. That’s a lot better than the “under a week” Denuvo cracking times that were making headlines in 2017 and means the vast majority of recent Denuvo-protected titles can’t be effectively pirated in their first month of two of sales, “where the bulk of the money is made for a premium game after being made available,” as Huin put it.

  • rederick29
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    1 year ago

    Surprised that it still had Denuvo up until now. I’m pretty sure they accidentally released a Denuvo-free executable on the day the game launched so the game was pretty much cracked instantly.

    I doubt Denuvo helped their initial sales at all. Doom Eternal is a good game and that’s what actually makes them money, not stopping the pirates out there.

    • echo64@lemmy.world
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      1 year ago

      All denuvo has to do is generate more sales than it costs to license. And it seems it does given how popular it is. If it wasn’t a profit generating thing for games companies then absolutely they wouldn’t pay for it.

  • nogrub@lemmy.world
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    1 year ago

    crys in armored core 6. even thou it’s really easy to run it without easy anti cheat

    • arefx@lemmy.ml
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      1 year ago

      It’s been running like a dream for a long time I can only imagine it runs impeccably

  • phx@lemmy.ca
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    1 year ago

    Did it have issues before? I used it on my SD a long time ago and it seemed fine

    • vividspecter@lemm.eeOP
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      It just means Denuvo DRM was removed, which can cause issues with offline setups. Probably won’t affect performance unless it was particularly poorly implemented.

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    1 year ago

    I didn’t realize it had Denuvo. Maybe their claims that Denuvo doesn’t impact performance isn’t as much of a lie as I’d thought. I’m still waiting on them to post benchmarks though.

    • null@slrpnk.net
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      1 year ago

      Looks more like a tricky headline. There’s 2 claims there: Denuvo was removed. The game plays great on the Deck. The headline is just making it look like one lead to the other.

      The article actually says “now that it’s removed, maybe it plays even better.” But doesn’t tell us if it does.

      Not to say Denuvo doesn’t have a performance impact, this just isn’t a smoking gun.