If it contains energy, there’s probably a way to make that energy release in an uncontrolled fashion. As energy densities increase, so does the risk if that happens.
Luckily batteries are built such that it’s actually quite hard to ignite them. As are fuel tanks for the same reason.
Cool. That’s not the only combustible material in a cell. And since a solid state battery only changes the electrolyte, everything else is unchanged. Meaning they are not significantly safer, because several types of liquid electrolyte aren’t flammable. Crucially, this is also a reason why solid state batteries are pointless for the foreseeable future, and only bring negatives to the table.
They are significantly safer. Current li-ion in cars have some very bad failure modes; just puncturing them can release a massive, uncontrollable fire that could potentially keep itself going while fully submerged in water. Now, even those are somewhat overblown–they’re pretty well protected in cars–but these problems aren’t universal to all lithium chemistries, much less all batteries in general.
Yes, they can catch fire. No, you don’t need four fire trucks worth of water tanks to put them out. This matters.
As in solid state has lower range, lower cycle life, and higher cost. Quite an amazing hill to be attempting to defend. lmfao
As for “so many” manufacturers, there aren’t many. And they’ve been working on this research project for two decades. Are you also a proponent of perpetual motion generators because people “have been working on them” for so long? It’s long term R&D because you have to hedge your bets. The battery tech itself still sucks.
which means more power in a smaller size and weight.
You’re conflating two metrics, which doesn’t bode well for this conversation. Gravimetric and volumetric densities are different, and so far solid state batteries don’t have an advantage on either front. The hope is that they will have a gravimetric density advantage at some point, but not necessarily volumetric.
Higher safety
I’ve already explained to you that existing LiB cells use non-flammable electrolytes, so this isn’t an advantage. You’re a decade behind the state of the art.
Shorter charging times
Which again hasn’t been demonstrated by anybody in real life yet.
as the solid electrolyte allows faster movement of ions.
Intercalation is still the slowest part of the transfer, and solid electrolyte does nothing for that. What might improve that is polymer doped cells, but so far that’s been another complete disaster.
A wider range of operating temperatures
Again the electrolyte is only a part of this equation. And while it doesn’t freeze like older LiB electrolyte would, we’re so far past this problem in most applications that nobody even cares anymore.
Longer lifespan
Nope. Every demonstration so far has VASTLY shorter cycle lifetimes, which is further exacerbated by the worse gravimetric density. I’m really not sure where you do any of your research, but reading press releases is rotting your mind with marketing hype.
From the people who are putting their money into it.
Then, why do we need a solid-state battery? It is to increase capacity of EV batteries.
Market research companies expect that EVs will replace ICEVs(internal combustion engine vehicles), and become the mainstream in the auto industry. And to become the unarguable leader in the industry, EV should have the similar level of mileage as the current ICEV, and it is important to increase the battery capacity of an EV battery to do so.
There are two ways to increase capacity. First is increasing the number of batteries. But in this case, the battery price goes up and batteries take up so much space in the vehicle.
A solid-state battery has higher energy density than a Li-ion battery that uses liquid electrolyte solution. It doesn’t have a risk of explosion or fire, so there is no need to have components for safety, thus saving more space. Then we have more space to put more active materials which increase battery capacity in the battery.
A solid-state battery can increase energy density per unit area since only a small number of batteries are needed. For that reason, a solid-state battery is perfect to make an EV battery system of module and pack, which needs high capacity.
You seem to be of the belief that no new battery tech ever reaches the market, which is obviously false. There is a lot of work going on to bring this to market. The truth is neither you or I know whether this will happen.
That isn’t what’s being discussed. We’re comparing cells to cells, not ICE to BEV.
I know… solid state doesn’t have a flammable liquid electrolyte
If it contains energy, there’s probably a way to make that energy release in an uncontrolled fashion. As energy densities increase, so does the risk if that happens.
Luckily batteries are built such that it’s actually quite hard to ignite them. As are fuel tanks for the same reason.
Cool. That’s not the only combustible material in a cell. And since a solid state battery only changes the electrolyte, everything else is unchanged. Meaning they are not significantly safer, because several types of liquid electrolyte aren’t flammable. Crucially, this is also a reason why solid state batteries are pointless for the foreseeable future, and only bring negatives to the table.
They are significantly safer. Current li-ion in cars have some very bad failure modes; just puncturing them can release a massive, uncontrollable fire that could potentially keep itself going while fully submerged in water. Now, even those are somewhat overblown–they’re pretty well protected in cars–but these problems aren’t universal to all lithium chemistries, much less all batteries in general.
Yes, they can catch fire. No, you don’t need four fire trucks worth of water tanks to put them out. This matters.
So you’re more than a decade behind on LiB tech. Got it. Now it makes sense why you think this boondoggle is even worth discussing.
Other than the massive difference in mileage and reduction in charge time? Sure
Why do you think there are so many manufacturers trying to scale solid state? For fun?
As in solid state has lower range, lower cycle life, and higher cost. Quite an amazing hill to be attempting to defend. lmfao
As for “so many” manufacturers, there aren’t many. And they’ve been working on this research project for two decades. Are you also a proponent of perpetual motion generators because people “have been working on them” for so long? It’s long term R&D because you have to hedge your bets. The battery tech itself still sucks.
The potential benefits are enough for Samsung to be building a pilot line. That’s an investment, a bet, and there are reasons why:
Higher energy density, which means more power in a smaller size and weight.
Higher safety, as the solid electrolyte is non-flammable and less prone to catch fire.
Shorter charging times, as the solid electrolyte allows faster movement of ions.
A wider range of operating temperatures, as the solid electrolyte is more stable and less affected by heat or cold.
Longer lifespan, as the solid electrolyte reduces the degradation of the electrodes
Nobody’s demonstrated this in real life yet.
You’re conflating two metrics, which doesn’t bode well for this conversation. Gravimetric and volumetric densities are different, and so far solid state batteries don’t have an advantage on either front. The hope is that they will have a gravimetric density advantage at some point, but not necessarily volumetric.
I’ve already explained to you that existing LiB cells use non-flammable electrolytes, so this isn’t an advantage. You’re a decade behind the state of the art.
Which again hasn’t been demonstrated by anybody in real life yet.
Intercalation is still the slowest part of the transfer, and solid electrolyte does nothing for that. What might improve that is polymer doped cells, but so far that’s been another complete disaster.
Again the electrolyte is only a part of this equation. And while it doesn’t freeze like older LiB electrolyte would, we’re so far past this problem in most applications that nobody even cares anymore.
Nope. Every demonstration so far has VASTLY shorter cycle lifetimes, which is further exacerbated by the worse gravimetric density. I’m really not sure where you do any of your research, but reading press releases is rotting your mind with marketing hype.
From the people who are putting their money into it.
https://www.samsungsdi.com/column/technology/detail/56462.html
You seem to be of the belief that no new battery tech ever reaches the market, which is obviously false. There is a lot of work going on to bring this to market. The truth is neither you or I know whether this will happen.
My bet is someone will crack it 👇
On fact LFP is “new” and it’s selling. My take is that idiotic developments with three decades of failure don’t reach the market.