I’m personally a huge fan of Lord of Chaos. It’s always a high point when I re-read the series. I really like all of the subtle foreshadowing of what’s coming up, all of the careful politics and groundwork that RJ laid for the latter half of the series, and then of course Dumai’s Wells is such an incredible moment in the series.

  • Landrin201@lemmy.mlOPM
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    1 year ago

    From talking with LOTS of readers, I’ve always gotten the impression that EOTW didn’t have much impact on most readers once they finish the series. EOTW is kinda just… there. Like, it’s fine- it’s a fun story, but it reads so differently from the rest of the series that it feels like a different book sometimes, and the events in it have practically no impact past TGH. TGH is where the longer-term plotlines really get established, but there are still some inconsistencies with the magic system because he hadn’t 100% ironed out all the details. Book one has by far the most inconsistencies with how magic works in the world, and it can be a bit confusing for new readers once they get to book 2 and everyone feels less powerful than they did in book 1.

    I’ve always been of the opinion that, looking at the series as a whole, EOTW was the weakest of the series, and not really where I feel it starts to feel like the wheel of time- that was always TDR for me.

    I’m actually considering writing up a real long post about an argument a friend of mine and I have been having for several months about what we would do to re-edit the series in hindsight if we were writing, say, a TV show adaptation, because I have a lot of thoughts about the structure of the first 3 books in hindsight and how they could have been VASTLY improved

    • abraxas@lemmy.mlM
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      1 year ago

      EotW is a middling book (I used to call it the weakest, but it’s hard to compare with some of the 8-10 range)

      What it does have is the best a-ha moments that can be squeezed into a single book. And almost all of those are spoiled by page 50 of TGH.

      Honestly, I think the only thing that really needs to die to make tEotW okay is the Eye itself… along with Moiraine’s silly reasoning to swap the trip to there. Being forced there more directly (the knife being taken, for example, or some mysterious message for the Amyrlin to avoid Tar Valon) would’ve cleaned it up.

      • Landrin201@lemmy.mlOPM
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        1 year ago

        I personally think that EOTW needed a bit more than that (spoilers all books):

        ::: spoiler

        1. I would have made Moiraine’s plan from minute one be to find the Dragon and take him to the Eye of the World. I would have a viewpoint from her perspective when they get out of the two rivers, and have her talk with Lan about why- and use that as a way to talk about the prophesies and how she needs a way to determine which of the three is the Dragon, and how the Eye of the World would be the easiest way to do that unless more than one of them can channel.

        2. I’d make it more of an Ensemble piece to preserve the mystery of “who is the dragon” and also to have more development for the other characters. If you tweaked Mat and Perrin’s backstories you could have all 3 boys clearly originate outside of the two rivers, further preserving the mystery of who the dragon is. I would cut the scene of Rand bring Tam to Emmond’s Field completley- I wouldn’t even have it happen off screen, it would just not be there. Rand already gets multiple identity crises throughout the series- this one is comparatively short lived. It works just as well if he is told by Moiraine at the Eye that he is the Dragon and Tam cannot be his father. I’d have Tam go to Caemlyn with Perrin in book 6, and have him and Rand talk- and have that conversation end with Rand angry with Tam, and confused, and not sure where to go from there. That better sets up the next conversation they would have in book 12, where Rand nearly kills him.

        3. I’d completely re-work the eye of the world scenes to damn near what the show did. I would cut the battle of Tarwhin’s Gap altogether, it isn’t necessary and never has impact again. Have the confrontation at the Eye be between Rand and Ishamael in the world of dreams, and have it reflect the central conflict of the end of the series, the way the show did. The other characters can fight Aginor and Balthamel while Rand is unconscious talking to Ishy or something.

        4. I would have Moiraine actively teach Egwene and Nynaeve to channel as much as she can in their travels. She teaches Egwene the bare basics, just so she won’t develop a block, but I would have her go much deeper than that. Especially with Nynaeve, I would have her teach her constantly as they search for Perrin and Egwene. That way they don’t feel like they go from barely knowing what channeling is to being surprisingly proficient at it early in book 2. If Moiraine begins the Forcing process by really pushing them to channel as much as possible, that becomes a lot more organic. :::

        • abraxas@lemmy.mlM
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          1 year ago

          I guess we see the Eye differently. I really liked the “who the hell am I?” side of Rand, isntead of “Who is the Dragon” ensemble. I think it was slightly too obvious, but obscure enough that new readers often had memories of when they “figured it out”. I actually liked the idea of the Dragon being a mysterious hero/villain that could as well have been an antogonist as the main character.

          And I really love the doubt and distrust we all have in Moiraine for the first several books. A POV opening of her would have ruined it, I think.

          I’m all-in with you for point 3. Power levels are all over the place, and while I don’t think Eye is the biggest offender, it doesn’t hurt to take out the canon-killing overchannel by Rand. And Somestha (Somestha who?)

          For point 4… I agree with more teaching of Eggy, but Nynaeve will be damned if she lets THAT AES SEDAI teach her anything. But you’re not wrong about wondergirl-mania. They get good way too fast, but that’s a steady issue the first 5 books or so (and doesn’t stop there).