For a long time, they didn’t. The RNC was legendarily attacked by the Tea Party movement, by Trump during the 2016 primaries, and continued to be slated by MAGA up to the point it was wholly taken over by Trump.
because when the Republican Party wasn’t serving the “needs” of it’s racist, xenophobic, misogynistic voter base, it was murdered and skinned by the Tea Party, who has gleefully worn the skin ever since.
Progressives have never done the same for the DNC, they’ve just let it continue being the same old shitty party for two decades. Every time they drift further rightward, people complain, and then forget.
Progressives have never done the same for the DNC, they’ve just let it continue being the same old shitty party for two decades. Every time they drift further rightward, people complain, and then forget.
I disagree on that part. Everyone is just fucking tired trying to save the country from our fellow dummies. We are just trying to survive and have no idea of what to do.
It’s fair to be tired, it’s exhausting having to do the same shit every four years.
but the reason we have to do it every four years is because everyone lets their civic duty end with voting. Whether or not you’re tired doesn’t mean the responsibilities end. Believe me, I know trying to get people to politically organize is an exercise in misery, but the Democratic Party is never going to change. People have to start supporting third parties in their local elections, and start forcing out Democrat politicians who have historically had safe seats.
The one and only good news I can provide is that we have the playbook the Tea Party left. Cannibalizing a party is possible, I watched it happen and have tried to oust my local Dems with independent leftist candidates ever since. Maybe if more people had realized the Dems were going to let them down forever sooner, we could have avoided all of this. Maybe we’ll never have elections again, and it’s all a moot point now anyway. but trying the same shit election after election is just not going to create change.
What would you have these people do differently once they’re in? I’m going to go through the issues and it ain’t “the dems.”
Russia did an amazing social media job and played the r’s like a fiddle. We probably don’t even know the half of it because of the bubble world they live in.
The r’s have placed SCOTUS judges that are openly corrupt and actively harmful to our country.
The r’s have placed judges to fuck with many states with gerrymandering and it worked.
Half of the voting public of America is sexist and racist.
I’ve seen an active population going after the dems today and it makes me laugh my ass off. It’s pretty good propaganda. The r’s voted for a monster and you’re blaming the people who thought there were enough decent people on that side to keep him away. Nope, we were wrong.
You simply can’t do anything for the Republicans. There is no hope for them. You have to assume that moving forward, at least half of voting Americans will go for a fascist. Ignore them completely. Sure, they clearly have the largest part of the blame, but none of them care and will laugh at you for trying to change their minds. The only option is to aim for independents, undecideds, and uncommitteds. Progressive policies remain overwhelming popular in the United States, you do not need conservatives to help you win elections.
As for what these leftists politicians should do once elected, the answer immediately is to caucus with the Dems and try to work with them on progressive issues like wage stagnation. It will fail, but it will identify which members of the Dems are willing to work with a new movement and which will not. Once a base of candidates is built in Dem strongholds, we can start working to replace the Dems who refuse to work with the new movement, even if they’re in battleground states.
again, I’m not inventing anything here. This is how the Tea Party killed the GOP from inside. There’s nothing stopping us from doing the same, but it takes a lot of participation in local races. The Tea Party started with state governments and House Representatives, and it took them nearly a decade to realize their dreams in the form of Donald Trump. It will likely take time we no longer have, but look at the last three elections and ask yourself this; do we have any other option?
You’re right, I didn’t mean to go after you. I’m just frustrated at how shitty our voting and purposely non-voting country is.
As far as dems go, Biden won with the Harris strategy. That’s what they thought would work against trump. Obviously they were wrong. There’s a bunch of gerrymandering (cheating) going on as well.
Here is the bottom line and what I don’t think people understand though, the people funding these campaigns for higher office don’t want progressives. That’s it, the end. How do you fix that now? People may vote for them if they’re given the opportunity, but they will never get the opportunity. That’s just the reality of it.
And again, that’s the shitty part, it requires a lot of fucking work. I have worked for independent leftist campaigns. It was incredibly long hours for weeks on end. Canvassing is gruelling work, cold calls are fucking miserable. Do you know how much money I typically made? None, not a single dime. The independents don’t have the support of big donors. In fact, I typically end up losing a few thousand dollars if I work for a campaign.
You have to make the reality you want with your own hands. You have to grab your friends and say “Hey, let’s all go to the town hall meeting tonight,” and double the attendance for the night. You have to make a hundred calls a day, getting laughed at all the time, just hoping to get your message out. Hell, depending on where you live and what options you have, you might have to run for office yourself. It’s hard, and it’s shitty and awful, but it’s the only option left when your leaders consistently fail you.
I will say though, it was a clear mistake to call 2020 a win for Biden. 2020 was a loss for Trump. Biden’s approval ratings were ass, he barely beat out Trump, and his approval just dropped further the second he entered office. If the DNC saw that and made the conclusion they could demand progressive votes for nothing a second time, then they’re incompetent.
I agree with you about the independent and working and all that, but that’s for lower offices. It’s totally doable, I live in Seattle and it’s done all the time. I’m talking higher office. Unless the r’s mass quit and all money is taken out, there is a .01% (not scientific) chance that a progressive would make it through the primaries.
The “both parties are the same” thing is one of the most successful right-wing talking points ever, just after “conservative parties are more fiscally responsible”.
That’s very true. I would love it to be arguments between progressive and normal democrats vs democrat vs fascist republican, but that’s not the world we live in. I’m angry at the voters, there is no way they didn’t know what they were voting for this time.
I would love to see some new form of having arguments that prevent all that going in circles with the same arguments reappearing again and again. Possibly even one where it matters less if you don’t think of just the correct way of phrasing it in the moment because the arguments can be refined in place and extra info like evidence added later, something like a wiki with a graph of common political arguments.
Somehow I feel the form of our public discourse, both within the various camps and in greater society, is in large part to blame for the state our political systems are in today. Sound-bites, tweets, short videos at best, headlines. Nuance is required for a lot of modern problems and it just isn’t there.
Lemmy is the best I’ve found so far even though the Russians and other trolls are here. The trolls are the only ones using shitty tactics and trying to guide the conversations with what they post. Most people here see it because we’re refugees from the bad place. Like the convo we’re having would have been downvoted to hell and back while trying to start a fight anywhere else.
I understand the general feeling you’re presenting, but I encourage you to be far more precise. You said everyone lets their civic duty go, and that’s just not true. I know many people, including myself, who have tried hard to effect change for the past few years or decades. Basic honesty suggests that you shouldn’t diminish our existence simply because we didn’t get the results that you wanted.
I don’t love or hate either, I’m largely disappointed by both. I’m disappointed w/ the RNC for allowing Trump to happen, and I’m disappointed with the DNC for forcing Harris to happen.
Since my vote is a lock-in for Trump (he won w/ like ~60% of the vote in each election), I vote for third party/independent candidates, because both major party candidates are completely unappealing. Since my vote won’t matter anyway, I instead choose to vote my conscience and show that throwing my vote away has more value than picking one of the two major party candidates.
Why do the republicans love the RNC no matter what and the democrats hate the DNC no matter what?
For a long time, they didn’t. The RNC was legendarily attacked by the Tea Party movement, by Trump during the 2016 primaries, and continued to be slated by MAGA up to the point it was wholly taken over by Trump.
because when the Republican Party wasn’t serving the “needs” of it’s racist, xenophobic, misogynistic voter base, it was murdered and skinned by the Tea Party, who has gleefully worn the skin ever since.
Progressives have never done the same for the DNC, they’ve just let it continue being the same old shitty party for two decades. Every time they drift further rightward, people complain, and then forget.
I disagree on that part. Everyone is just fucking tired trying to save the country from our fellow dummies. We are just trying to survive and have no idea of what to do.
It’s fair to be tired, it’s exhausting having to do the same shit every four years.
but the reason we have to do it every four years is because everyone lets their civic duty end with voting. Whether or not you’re tired doesn’t mean the responsibilities end. Believe me, I know trying to get people to politically organize is an exercise in misery, but the Democratic Party is never going to change. People have to start supporting third parties in their local elections, and start forcing out Democrat politicians who have historically had safe seats.
The one and only good news I can provide is that we have the playbook the Tea Party left. Cannibalizing a party is possible, I watched it happen and have tried to oust my local Dems with independent leftist candidates ever since. Maybe if more people had realized the Dems were going to let them down forever sooner, we could have avoided all of this. Maybe we’ll never have elections again, and it’s all a moot point now anyway. but trying the same shit election after election is just not going to create change.
What would you have these people do differently once they’re in? I’m going to go through the issues and it ain’t “the dems.”
I’ve seen an active population going after the dems today and it makes me laugh my ass off. It’s pretty good propaganda. The r’s voted for a monster and you’re blaming the people who thought there were enough decent people on that side to keep him away. Nope, we were wrong.
You simply can’t do anything for the Republicans. There is no hope for them. You have to assume that moving forward, at least half of voting Americans will go for a fascist. Ignore them completely. Sure, they clearly have the largest part of the blame, but none of them care and will laugh at you for trying to change their minds. The only option is to aim for independents, undecideds, and uncommitteds. Progressive policies remain overwhelming popular in the United States, you do not need conservatives to help you win elections.
As for what these leftists politicians should do once elected, the answer immediately is to caucus with the Dems and try to work with them on progressive issues like wage stagnation. It will fail, but it will identify which members of the Dems are willing to work with a new movement and which will not. Once a base of candidates is built in Dem strongholds, we can start working to replace the Dems who refuse to work with the new movement, even if they’re in battleground states.
again, I’m not inventing anything here. This is how the Tea Party killed the GOP from inside. There’s nothing stopping us from doing the same, but it takes a lot of participation in local races. The Tea Party started with state governments and House Representatives, and it took them nearly a decade to realize their dreams in the form of Donald Trump. It will likely take time we no longer have, but look at the last three elections and ask yourself this; do we have any other option?
You’re right, I didn’t mean to go after you. I’m just frustrated at how shitty our voting and purposely non-voting country is.
As far as dems go, Biden won with the Harris strategy. That’s what they thought would work against trump. Obviously they were wrong. There’s a bunch of gerrymandering (cheating) going on as well.
Here is the bottom line and what I don’t think people understand though, the people funding these campaigns for higher office don’t want progressives. That’s it, the end. How do you fix that now? People may vote for them if they’re given the opportunity, but they will never get the opportunity. That’s just the reality of it.
And again, that’s the shitty part, it requires a lot of fucking work. I have worked for independent leftist campaigns. It was incredibly long hours for weeks on end. Canvassing is gruelling work, cold calls are fucking miserable. Do you know how much money I typically made? None, not a single dime. The independents don’t have the support of big donors. In fact, I typically end up losing a few thousand dollars if I work for a campaign.
You have to make the reality you want with your own hands. You have to grab your friends and say “Hey, let’s all go to the town hall meeting tonight,” and double the attendance for the night. You have to make a hundred calls a day, getting laughed at all the time, just hoping to get your message out. Hell, depending on where you live and what options you have, you might have to run for office yourself. It’s hard, and it’s shitty and awful, but it’s the only option left when your leaders consistently fail you.
I will say though, it was a clear mistake to call 2020 a win for Biden. 2020 was a loss for Trump. Biden’s approval ratings were ass, he barely beat out Trump, and his approval just dropped further the second he entered office. If the DNC saw that and made the conclusion they could demand progressive votes for nothing a second time, then they’re incompetent.
I agree with you about the independent and working and all that, but that’s for lower offices. It’s totally doable, I live in Seattle and it’s done all the time. I’m talking higher office. Unless the r’s mass quit and all money is taken out, there is a .01% (not scientific) chance that a progressive would make it through the primaries.
The “both parties are the same” thing is one of the most successful right-wing talking points ever, just after “conservative parties are more fiscally responsible”.
That’s very true. I would love it to be arguments between progressive and normal democrats vs democrat vs fascist republican, but that’s not the world we live in. I’m angry at the voters, there is no way they didn’t know what they were voting for this time.
I would love to see some new form of having arguments that prevent all that going in circles with the same arguments reappearing again and again. Possibly even one where it matters less if you don’t think of just the correct way of phrasing it in the moment because the arguments can be refined in place and extra info like evidence added later, something like a wiki with a graph of common political arguments.
Somehow I feel the form of our public discourse, both within the various camps and in greater society, is in large part to blame for the state our political systems are in today. Sound-bites, tweets, short videos at best, headlines. Nuance is required for a lot of modern problems and it just isn’t there.
Lemmy is the best I’ve found so far even though the Russians and other trolls are here. The trolls are the only ones using shitty tactics and trying to guide the conversations with what they post. Most people here see it because we’re refugees from the bad place. Like the convo we’re having would have been downvoted to hell and back while trying to start a fight anywhere else.
I understand the general feeling you’re presenting, but I encourage you to be far more precise. You said everyone lets their civic duty go, and that’s just not true. I know many people, including myself, who have tried hard to effect change for the past few years or decades. Basic honesty suggests that you shouldn’t diminish our existence simply because we didn’t get the results that you wanted.
Vote Green. That’s what you do.
Because one delivers on its promises. They promise hate and divisiveness and deliver in kind. Democrats promise hope when what we need is action.
Maybe it’s the fact that America’s national character is to lust for domination and revenge. Compassion cannot win because America despises it.
What action do you think we should do? Real talk. The government has been taken over a long time ago by anti-democracy peeps, how do we get it back?
The DNC suppresses leftist voices and demands leftist votes.
I don’t love or hate the DNC but I do hate the RNC.
I don’t love or hate either, I’m largely disappointed by both. I’m disappointed w/ the RNC for allowing Trump to happen, and I’m disappointed with the DNC for forcing Harris to happen.
Since my vote is a lock-in for Trump (he won w/ like ~60% of the vote in each election), I vote for third party/independent candidates, because both major party candidates are completely unappealing. Since my vote won’t matter anyway, I instead choose to vote my conscience and show that throwing my vote away has more value than picking one of the two major party candidates.