Unnecessary and deeply concerning bow to the new “king”
Taking the time to remove Google, embraced proton mail … Maybe it’s time to just write letters and send meme post cards.
Meme post cards are a great idea actually.
Ffs. I just switched a ton of stuff over to proton. Hopefully this is an individuals view and not that of the company as a whole.
First strike Andy.
Dude got weird “Libertarian” vibes:
But he’s just one of five board members of the Non-Profit that owns Proton AG, not really a doomsday event… yet.
…and your out. That’s enough for me.
Very disappointing that this is the CEO and founder of Proton. I’ll be moving my stuff elsewhere and deleting my account this week.
Just canceled my subscription.
Standing up for the little guy. Huh. Is that why billionaires and CEO are throwing literal tens of millions at Trump? Why he staffed his cabinet with billionaires? Why the center of his policy is tax cuts for the giga wealthy, at the expense of everyone else and the national debt, at a time where wealth inequality is literally tearing the country apart?
https://www.axios.com/2025/01/15/trump-windfall-fundraising-500-million
https://www.axios.com/2024/12/09/trump-wealth-cabinet-politicians-billionaires
These are objective, public facts. Like, I’m way more conservative than Lemmy’s center and willing acknowledge any good Trump does, but what reality is this guy living in? Who is this statement for? Who the heck does he think is using Proton services? He just pissed off his employees and customers for… What?
Probably doesn’t want to get banned in the US… Or so my copium tells me.
Silver lining is that Proton is owned by a non-profit.
I was thinking this for a second, but is this really plausible? Normally when we talk about corporations we talk about how powerful they are and how they use different nations to locate headquarters and offices in order to mitigate legal and tax obligations. We regularly talk about how governments can’t reign them in and how they act with impunity.
But now? “They HAVE to capitulate. They are just doing it to survive.” Really? Do we really believe that? Or is it more likely that this is what they want and if they didn’t, they’d be fighting tooth and nail to stop it? I’m with the second option honestly.
Seems a lot of people share this view that somehow he’s for the little guy, despite quite clearly being for the opposite. It’s the same over the pond, there’s a paranoia held by many that the government is out to persecute the common people. Very strange on both sides, it’s almost Orwell levels of Newspeak.
Hmm… is Tuta still good these days?
It’s not bad
God. Fucking. Dam. It.
I use too many of their services right now to get everything switched over to something else before trump takes power.
The swiss better fucking jail this guy if he hands over data to the us government without swiss court approval, per swiss law.
Now I have to find a new password manager, VPN, and email provider. Open to suggestions, but I want to find services that aren’t hosed in the us or by trump friendly countries/companies, and ideally use open source software and zero access encryption.
For the email provider i recommend tuta
Mullvad for VPN, Bitwarden for password manager.
Yea I previously used bitwarden, my issue with it is that bitwarden is hosted in the US(which was the only reason I switched to PP), so I’m thinking about renting a vps and hosting vaultwarden in it or something.
say what you will about trump. sure hes a small pathetic man. sure he is under musk and putin, but there are people under him. He may be a sycophant but he is the head sycophant.
There is no ethical consumption under capitalism, and that applies to tech. I pay for Proton and this is disappointing af but not shocking. Corporations and wannabe billionaires always fold to fascism.
Gonna start looking around at alternative email services to consider but I use my Proton email everywhere, so switching away is going to suck.
Ingl, I think the only way to stay sane these times is to ignore what they say and look at what they do. As long as his products are up to my standards and values, I’ll just ignore whatever he says to appease whomever
Agreed. If I haphazardly ditched services based on the opinions of tech folks, I’d be reduced to using a pair of cans attached with string and nothing else.
Were the cans and string ethically sourced, though?
Yep… But CEOs bootlicking daddy trump is pathetic non the less…
What people define should not be doing is using Proton as one stop shop like they did with Google.
Got to stay nimble
I mean, dude is one out of 5 board members:
Yeah, I think (hope?) we will find that his opinion is not echoed among them.
no ethical consumption under capitalism
I agree with this as much as the next guy, but this is also kinda cope.
Glad I changed my stack over a few months ago:
- Proton Mail → Posteo
- Proton VPN → Mullvad VPN
- Proton Drive → Syncthing
I’d also recommend KeePassXC in place of Proton Pass, and Cake Wallet in place of Proton Wallet. However, these were both Proton services I never used anyway.
Long time Posteo user. It’s pretty basic but works great, is reliable and is very cheap. Only downside is they don’t support using it with your own domain.
Oh, goddammit.
And then we have the communists making Lemmy. Is there any moderate developers lol. Valve is the only big company I can think of that isn’t annoying. All the faceless Linux devs are good too
Glances at the child gambling enabled by the steam marketplace, an issue being blatantly ignored by Valve leadership.
Buddy, I don’t know how to tell you this. I love Valve for all the good they do, but they got some serious skeletons, too.
Valve representatives were asked point blank if the third party gambling sites have a positive influence on their bottom line, and the dude replying sweated bullets for several seconds before nervously going “we… don’t have any data on that” while the rest stared daggers at him.
Coffeezilla has a recent video on the situation.
I love Steam, but thinking about switching to gog over this. Anybody have any ideas how we can let valve know this isn’t okay?
If it’s between fascism and communism, the answer is pretty fucking simple imo. Only one of those ideologies considers all people to be equal.
And no, I am not a communist, and I would not choose communism unless it was the only alternative to fascism.
I fear for what will happen to valve when Gabr step down in the future
I have a bigger fear of what happens to Linux when Torvalds retires. He took a break a while back, and it was an absolute shit show of a power struggle.
Yeah, it would be nice if the people making all this shit were just … normal.
fuck off booooooot licker
The writing was on the wall for proton for a while now
No it hasn’t. Back this claim up with some evidence
I wouldn’t call it “writing on the wall,” but they have done some not-so-good things over the last few years:
- Handing over data for their email services (which was legally required) (ref).
- Releasing a Bitcoin wallet. The problem for me is that Bitcoin is inherently not private.
- Lying in marketing. Proton claims “no data or speed limits” for their free VPN (ref), which is just plain wrong. If you download a few gigs, it will slow you down to a few Mbit (if I remember correctly). I even contacted their support about this, and they just said, “They are balancing the servers for the free VPN.” But then why was it fast in the beginning, and if I reconnected to the same server, would it be fast again. Just to be clear: I have no problem with the speed limit/balancing itself, just that they are lying about it.
- Proton incentivizing free email accounts to connect to a Gmail account to get 500 MB more storage. (You need to go through the “tutorial” steps to get the 500 MB extra, and one of them is to have a Google Mail account send all their emails to your new Proton inbox.)
This is why I personally decided against Proton.
These are useful data for making decisions about using their service, but not exactly indicative of support for a right wing authoritarian leader who lies more in one day than he has hairs on his entire body.
Edit: typo
Mostly true, that’s why I opened with “I wouldn’t call it writing on the wall.” But for me, it shows that they are not as privacy- and consumer-focused as they like to present themselves. Supporting Trump is just five steps further in this direction. (That’s just how I feel about it.)
that’s why I opened with “I wouldn’t call it writing on the wall.”
Damn; you’re right. My bad. I somehow missed your opener saying exactly the opposite of what you were saying.
Everything you said is true and verifiable, and worth considering when you decide which service to use. It’s a lot of reasons to favor the .onion/tor version of their service to limit what they have access to depending on your privacy stance.
They are indicative of opportunism and greed, which is exactly in line with preemptively sucking up to a future dictator.
Yea! I’m interested, I did not see that coming…
Neither did I.
Proton Wallet
They’ve been cooperating with law enforcement and handing data to the cops proactively since 2021.
Pay attention.
What do you mean with “proactively”?
He does realize that Big Tech loves trump, right?
Sure, yeah, anti-big tech.
Let’s not get carried away. The scope of the comment is pretty narrow if you read it closely. This is one member of a 5-person board that also includes Tim Berners-Lee. The foundation structure is also a protection against abuses.
Yes you are right, and no you are not. It is concerning and something to stay vigilent about in the upcoming times.
Can’t you both be right? One it is a very narrow complement and also it be very concerning that the “small tech” is also bowing harder than big tech.
But this may be the price for not donating?
Let’s not get carried away. The scope of the comment is pretty narrow if you read it closely
The only thing I want to hear from you is that you actively disavow Trump, or if you feel this is going to hurt your business, at least say nothing at all. Anything other than that marks you as a shameless suck-up, and I want nothing to do with you or your business.
Ergo, I want nothing to do with Proton. It’s time suck-ups pay the price and see their bottom lines drop because of their dubious choices.
Who makes your phone?
Who makes your computer?
Who is your ISP?
Who do you bank with?
What email client do you use?
Let’s take a closer look.
I get what you’re driving at truly but man we do what we can and accept we can’t be perfect. I avoid Amazon as much as I can. I’ve left google, I don’t shop at Walmart. I don’t eat chik fil a. I try to avoid known evil brands where I can knowing I can’t be perfect.
Proton gives me a lot of what I need and is exponentially better/more ethical than major competitors like Google. I am good with computers but not good enough to roll my own entire email/calendar/cloud storage system. We sometimes have to accept compromise or i guess just simply not participate in modern society.
I think the big difference is what the companies stand for.
If the CEO of The Anti-Spyware Company comes out in support of Spyware, is that not significantly worse than the CEO of The Spyware Company doing the same?
I supported The Anti-Spyware companies because of what they believed in. Now that is in question.
FWIW I don’t use Proton but switching to it was in my 2025 plans. Not so sure about that anymore…
Dude is not a “CEO”, hes one of five board members of the Non-Profit organization that owns Proton AG.
Good to know, I was just going off what OP said
Your comparison would be appropriate if this was a statement coming out in favor of spyware. Additionally if we looked more closely at who you support, I bet we would find some pretty egregious contradictions with your values/the business’s purported values.
All of us would fail at some point if we were scrutinized. That’s why an all or nothing purity test is not productive. We do the best we can where possible and accept that none of us truly have the 100% perfect moral high ground. So it follows that to hold others to that standard is ridiculous.
All right then replace support of Spyware with “praise for The Spyware Company”
He’s not taking about spyware or anything like it. You’re forcing this.
Spyware was just an example? Proton is all about privacy and this board member is saying good things about a guy who doesn’t think us peasants should have any.
I agree that this isn’t the worst thing to ever happen. But I also agree with the people saying he shouldn’t have said anything.
Fastmail is pretty great :)
I am good with computers but not good enough to roll my own entire email/calendar/cloud storage system
NextCloud is almost an “out of the box” experience for all of these.
I looked into them about a year ago and for some reason I decided not to move forward. I don’t remember why so perhaps I’ll take a second look
if you disavow every company contributing to the republican party/trump you might as well sell all your belongs, and learn to live off grid. no internet access, no power, no retail.
we just dont live in a black and white world. its lovely shades of depressing grey gradients.
If I could live off grid I would. It’s not even an option. I’m forced to live like caged rat in a society that crushes my soul.
if you disavow every company contributing to the republican party/trump you might as well sell all your belongs, and learn to live off grid. no internet access, no power, no retail.
As much as possible, I will take my business to companies that aren’t openly terrible.
we just dont live in a black and white world
Tell that to the orange utan. He sure is about to turn the word from RGB to 1-pixel color space.
Do you really think I want to split people into people I can talk to vs. people I want to avoid at all costs? Trump is doing that. He’s forcing shitty choices on everybody. I’d rather have constructive and peaceful interaction with my fellow man. But can you honestly shake hands with a magard and not feel sick to your stomach? I can’t.
right, i agree the idea is revolting… but the old man at the dog park who only watches fox news isnt inherently evil. hes brainwashed. hes a fellow human who if shown the light would absolutely change his tune. to abandon those people is to abandon civilization.
sure thats not everyone, but its enough. we just need to show them the truth… that theyve been lied to and actually do have a choice.
treating every conservative voter as you would trump himself is absolutely painting in black and white.
we just need to show them the truth
I once read this on lemmy and it stuck with me. I think it applies here:
The autistic trait that bites me in the ass most often is the unshakable belief that if I can just show someone the truth, they’ll believe me.
True for me, and worse, I never seem to learn.
Fuck, that’s just exactly me. It’s an autism trait??
More and more, I approach wishing everyone was autistic lmao
but the old man at the dog park who only watches fox news isnt inherently evil
I’m sorry but no.
You have the die-hard racist MAGAs with the flags and the red cap. Those can fuck right off obviously.
But you also have all the ordinary folks who are NOT die-hard MAGA, but who decided that it was okay to vote for a convicted felon who tried to overthrow the government. And guess what: in a sense, they’re even worse.
Voting for Trump is crossing a line. If you voted for Trump, I really don’t want anything to do with you because you have proved to me that your sense of morality and your respect for the institutions of this country are compromised.
Either that or so fucking stupid that interacting with them wouldn’t be worth my time. I honestly used to believe what originallucifer said, but after this election i’ve been thoroughly and completely radicalized.
remember that 88 million people who can vote, dont.
many of those that did vote are under a veil of propaganda. theyre not all rabid maga racists. its been proven that one-on-one interaction with adversaries can often change their minds. its just a slow, painful process.
hes a fellow human who if shown the light would absolutely change his tune.
Thats not always true… That old man stuck on Fox News would likely rather shoot a bunch of brown people than admit he was wrong.
Sure, there’s not always an option, but sometimes there is. My tiny bit of $ isn’t going to make or break a company, but i try to give it to places who donate less to the big orange turd. I’m in a constant struggle choosing among home Depot, lowes, and Ace hardware.
no internet access, no power, no retail.
Does this actually sound like a utopia to anyone else or just me?
Do you even use Proton?
I do yes - VPN. I won’t next month though.
Just be aware that this is a peculiarly American take. In Europe at least, most people will agree that somebody’s opinions cannot somehow pollute whatever it is that they produce. Be it a traded good, or art, or in this case software.
Americans did not invent the idea of voting with their wallets. What a preposterous claim
The concept that wrong opinions are like a taint that rubs off on everything they touch is indeed pretty uniquely American (with some echos in the rest of the anglosphere). It explains much of the craziness and bitterness of US politics in recent years. It is absolutely not replicated in, for example, Catholic Europe.
Avoiding giving your money to companies that go against your politics isn’t some irrational “tainted” concept. Not sure why you’re insisting it is. It’s just not supporting things you don’t want to happen. These companies donate to and otherwise push forward bad policy. Also, still not sure where you got that Americans invented any of this, or how it would relate to the recent increase in polarization
This is a guy’s personal opinion about one aspect of a politician’s program. The only fact he mentions is just that, a fact. His insinuation that Democrats are supported by big business is also fairly defensible. There’s no obvious link to his company’s practices. The opinion is banal and widespread. You and a bunch of others here are treating this semi-non-story like some kind of religious heresy. I can tell you’re American just from that fact.
His insinuation that Democrats are supported by big business is also fairly defensible
The truth comes out. You think this is a “both sides” thing, and you agree with it.
No, what’s being said ITT is that he’s praising trump prematurely and people don’t want to support a business run by people who do that. Incredibly simple, and might I add, logical.
This. Also, in Europe you can get internet, electricity, email from coops. There are even some “ethical banks” and some survivors from the 2008 (at least in Sapin) as “small savings rural banks” (cajas de ahorros).
And if you aren’t a rich progressist and can’t afford some expensive eco-bio-coop consume, there are 2d hand options, food recicling, stealing is easy enough (and nobody will shoot a bullet to you for this) and so on. So, yeah, off-the-grid is a legit option, but on-the-grid stealing electricity from huge power corps is super legit also. No need to go to the caves.
Even in case of no alternative (say, I must have an id and a cellphone number), this doesn’t justify anything from CEOs. Fun fact is, in the case of Proton, there is PLENTY of alternatives. So, let’s use all the colorful gradients instead of accepting to remain in a dark-gray scale
Idk in the rest of Europe, but in France I’ve witnessed the contrary a lot of times. I do however not have a study on a big enough sample to make a claim, this is all anecdotal evidence on my side.
Examples please. France is the classic example of a country where most people put the art before the artist. The partial exception, unsurprisingly, is younger people who are more plugged into the poisonous world of America’s culture wars.
Even Michael Jackson?
Absolutely, yes. Great example. Great music. I guarantee you that almost everyone outside of the US-centric bit of the anglosphere agrees with me here.
Well, assuming they actually like music, of course.
It send a chill down my spine nonetheless
Yes. The “Trump was a good idea after all” take seems almost to be spreading like a meme at this point.
that also includes Tim Berners-Lee
You mean that traitorous piece of shit who sold us out to DRM on the Web?
Actually I ended up coming round to his view on this. If Firefox has stuck to its principles on DRM, then it would have been goodbye Firefox. And then you would have had no decent options at all, and neither would I. The setting is still opt-in.
Sometimes we have to compromise.
Yeah plus it’s a swiss company…with a crypto banking feature. They probably just want to attract Nazi bitcoin.
What?? „Stands for the Little guys“
Are you fucking tripping?!
It’s double-speak, right here 41 years later for your aural pleasure.
In people fall for it all again 😓 it is so sad
