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That’s fucked up. A haka should be taken very seriously. She used a haka to make the statement specifically to utilize the most powerful tool available to convey the message. It’s a traditional form of communication of the people she represents. She was doing her job in the best way possible. They clearly missed the entire point, since they are treating it the same as “yelling”, as if it was a childish reactionary response, instead of a carefully considered and measured response.
Time and place though, this was done in such a way that it would disrupt a vote in Parliament, which is kinda one of the most important things they do.
Letting this go would have set a terrible precedent.
If you only follow the rules of people in power, protest will be sidelined to where it causes no disruption. Which makes it very ineffective, which of course is the point.
Oh no. She broke decorum. How dare she! I guess to you guys decorum is more important than lives and suffering of actual real human beings.
this was done in such a way that it would disrupt a vote in Parliament, which is kinda one of the most important things they do.
No shit? That was very clearly the point. However, that was the “time and place”, after already attempting to handle it in their oppressor’s preferred “time and place” they had to stand up and show how serious they were about opposing a new interpretation of law that would diminish their rights.
Letting it go would have set a terrible precedent, indeed. If they just “let it go” without protest they would have let their people lose their rights.
What they did was stand up for their people (what they are supposed to do) with the utmost conviction, instead of “letting it go”. That’s something that should be honored, not punished.
I know you meant “letting this go” as in not punishing their protest, but that’s completely ignoring the fact they fucked up first in pushing them to need to protest in the first place.
Okay but what you are talking about is civil disobedience.
Civil disobedience is the nonviolent, conscious, and public refusal to obey certain laws, demands, or commands of a government or occupying power, usually as a form of protest. A key aspect is that the person accepts the legal consequences of their actions to highlight the perceived injustice of the law or policy they are opposing.
Prominent examples include:
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Mahatma Gandhi’s Salt March (against British colonial salt laws)
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Martin Luther King Jr. and the U.S. Civil Rights Movement
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Thoreau’s refusal to pay the poll tax, which he described in Civil Disobedience
The acceptance of punishment is what often distinguishes civil disobedience from other forms of lawbreaking.
Like others you mentioned these MPs will indeed take the punishment doled out by the Pakeha and like those other instances it will result in the public siding with them.
Which is exactly as I expected. I was trying to reassure the parent commenter that [regarding the punishment] things are proceeding just as the MPs wished for things to happen; that the punishment is being drawn intentionally and is something to be celebrated by their supporters; and I suppose that condemning Parliament for applying it is performative.
That’s bullshit. They would have obviously preferred not to be punished and prevent from participating in the parliament like they were elected to do.
This punishment will backfire on NACT though. It will point out how racist they are and how much they hate the indigenous people of this country. Their embrace of white supremacism and MAGA identity politics is in full display.
That’s bullshit. They would have obviously preferred not to be punished and prevent from participating in the parliament like they were elected to do.
Obviously. In that universe, they don’t perform the haka at all. They don’t need to protest. The haka was protest! Done illegally(*)! Knowingly and intentionally! That’s called fucking civil disobedience. THE PUNISHMENT IS PART OF THE PROTEST. Jesus fucking fuck, dude. In your mind, do you imagine they expected that maybe they wouldn’t get punished?? They KNEW, and that’s part of the fucking reason they DID IT. Jesus fuck.
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However, that was the “time and place”, after already attempting to handle it in their oppressor’s preferred “time and place” they had to stand up and show how serious they were about opposing a new interpretation of law that would diminish their rights.
In NZ Parliament, everyone gets to speak, often heatedly and repeatedly, then everyone gets to vote. She wanted to stop others from voting. That’s a big no in a democracy. Fascist tactics like this have no place in a democracy. Had she been allowed to prevent a democratic vote, what do you think happens the next time a left wing party tries to pass something contentious? And just to be clear, these are the three principles in the Bill:
———————————————
Principle 1
The Executive Government of New Zealand has full power to govern, and the Parliament of New Zealand has full power to make laws,—
a) the best interests of everyone; and
b) in accordance with the rule of law and the maintenance of a free and democratic society.
Principle 2
The Crown recognises, and will respect and protect, the rights that hapū and iwi Māori had under the Treaty of Waitangi/te Tiriti o Waitangi at the time they signed it.
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The Crown recognises, and will respect and protect, the rights that hapū and iwi Māori had under the Treaty of Waitangi/te Tiriti o Waitangi at the time they signed it.
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However, if those rights differ from the rights of everyone, subclause (1) applies only if those rights are agreed in the settlement of a historical treaty claim under the Treaty of Waitangi Act 1975.
Principle 3
1) Everyone is equal before the law.
2) Everyone is entitled, without discrimination, to—
a) the equal protection and equal benefit of the law; and
b) the equal enjoyment of the same fundamental human rights
———————————————-
So this woman was literally protesting against the introduction of racial equality and equal human rights protections in New Zealand. Her party is racially supremacist, and believe that Maori are a genetically superior race.
In September 2020, Ikaroa-Rāwhiti candidate Heather Te Au-Skipworth released the party’s sports policy which included establishing a national Māori sporting body and investing in Māori sporting scholarships and programs. She also stated "it is a known fact that Māori genetic makeup is stronger than others…”
Yikes. That is an awful statement. I had an initial reaction thinking “maybe they meant it in some way that doesn’t mean that” but I quickly realized how dumb that sounds.
Before I wrote my previous comment, I did some searching to double check what I thought I remembered about the situation, and I found only articles that portrayed the haka as a protest against a reduction of rights. Even after reading over what you quoted and more from the bill, I am unsure if it’s as good as the language makes it seem or if it does reduce rights. I’m really not qualified to determine that myself.
Before your edit, you linked wsws.org, which from what I can tell is pretty factual and they claim that public funds were given to corporations by the TPM.
So, I’ve now got a bunch of contradictory information and I’m not sure what to rely on. The genetics quote is definitely accurate though, and that’s a real tough one to make a good case that it didn’t mean “genetic superiority”, even though that’s not quite the words that were used. It just seems like such a contradictory stance in contrast to the other things I’ve seen about the party.
Thanks for the info. It seems like it’s gonna be tough for me to try to dig out the facts and figure out what to believe.
I think what helps is to remember that real life is messy. The New Zealand Maori party are unequivocally racist and arguably fascist, but they don’t represent all Maori. At the same time, some Maori still have legitimate grievances with the government which are yet to be settled. We can hold both of these facts in mind simultaneously. Of course it means we don’t have a clear caricature of the good and the bad guys, but history is usually not as black and white as that.
FYI I edited the wsws.org link because I don’t know if it’s reputable and sometimes people pick at the source instead of the content if it suits their narrative. Wikipedia is usually accepted. Plus it has citations.
The Maori party, or at least a few of their MPs, are brown supremacists, and say shit that would incite violence if a white person said them about Maori.
They are much less racist than ACT or NZ first though. I mean I don’t know how it would be possible to be more racist than them in this country.
Lol fuck off. Writing down “actually we’ve unilaterally decided everyone is equal now” after decades of theft and oppression is not equality.
How rich to be accusing others of fascism when the party that pushes this is so strongly linked to facism and regression across the world.
So what are you arguing for? More racial inequality? More structural racism? We overcome racism by stamping it out where we find it. We do not solve anything by making racism even worse. A most fundamental premise of any Western democracy is that we are all equal under the law, irrespective of our race. If you can’t agree on that then I suggest you take a long, hard look at your values.
We are not all equal under the law though. Why are you pretending there is no racism and everybody is on equal ground and we can just ignore race?
That’s nuts.
We are not all equal under the law though.
If that were true then why oppose a Bill making everyone equal under the law? That’s clearly not true.
Why are you pretending there is no racism and everybody is on equal ground and we can just ignore race?
Quote where I make those claims. You’re fighting ghosts.
You don’t stamp out racism but just one sidedly declaring racism is over all of a sudden, having done nothing to address the actual harm that has been caused.
Actually you do stop racism by stopping racism. It’s really that simple. I’ve lost patience with racists. All racists think their racism is justified. It’s not.
This bill was not about racial equality. Do you actually think anybody with five brain cells to rub together believes that bullshit?
The treaty is the treaty. One signatory can’t unilaterally decide they don’t want to be bound by it anymore or that they get to decide how it’s interpreted.
This bill was not about racial equality.
I quoted the actual legislation which shows that it is clearly about racial equality.
The treaty is the treaty. One signatory can’t unilaterally decide they don’t want to be bound by it anymore or that they get to decide how it’s interpreted.
Are you arguing that the Treaty requires structural racism in New Zealand? If so, fuck the treaty. Racism has no place in a modern society. I should also inform you that, legally speaking, the Treaty is non-binding. Neither the government nor the people have any requirement to follow any part of it.
While the Treaty is widely seen as a constitutional document, its status in New Zealand law is less than settled. At the moment, Treaty rights can only be enforced in a court of law when a statute or an Act explicitly refers to the Treaty.
You quoted a tiny little bit, the overall bill was racist. It sought to strip rights away from the Maori and only the Maori in this country.
Are you arguing that the Treaty requires structural racism in New Zealand?
The bill was structurally racist.
Racism has no place in a modern society.
Then why is it so widespread amongst ACT and NZ first and National voters?
I should also inform you that, legally speaking, the Treaty is non-binding.
It’s the foundational document of our nation.
Neither the government nor the people have any requirement to follow any part of it.
Then why are the racist in this country trying to reinterpret it?
You quoted a tiny little bit, the overall bill was racist. It sought to strip rights away from the Maori and only the Maori in this country… The bill was structurally racist.
Which part? Be specific. Quote the parts you’re referring to.
Then why is it so widespread amongst ACT and NZ first and National voters?
Just because you think your political opponents are racist doesn’t give you the right to be as evil.
It’s the foundational document of our nation.
That’s not a good excuse for keeping institutional racism. Slavery used to be a foundational part of American society but they changed it.
Then why are the racist in this country trying to reinterpret it?
I don’t know who you’re referring to by in this case they’re clearly just stating they want legal equality.
Thank you for explaining this in a way I don’t have the patience for.
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Race relations are cooked. Its only going to get worse from here. Thanks national.
NACT was itching to start a race war and they did.
We’ll have no nonsense from those uppity natives while government tries to retroactively rewrite history with legislation.
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Speaker of the House,Chair of the Privileges Committee (probably)In this case the Speaker is actually pushing back against the committee’s recommendations. There’s a really good write up from RNZ here: https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/561329/the-house-parliamentary-privileges-race-as-an-aggravating-factor
That refreshing to read.
It’s always nice to set bullies get some blue back.
Damn I hope that doesn’t pass
It didn’t. Not even close. It failed 121-11
Those 11 were members of the party that proposed it, and every other party voted against it unanimously.
The beauty of it all is that the actual step back for the treaty happened in the resource management act changes, while everyone was focused on the treaty principles bill.
Agreed. This was the sad part.
Didn’t this happen a couple months ago as well? Guess it was a good publicity move?
The haka itself was a few months ago.
Man few months to punish the people who broke decorum. They are really falling behind. How can they possibly let this breaking of decorum be unpunished for months! The decorum was broken! This shall not stand!!!
The decorum is the most important thing in the universe!
The wheels of beauraucracy turn slowly
Honestly, parliament has strict rules around decorum for a reason, if they didn’t our politicians would be screaming at each other on a daily basis.
If my politicians actually screamed at each other and disrupted the process rather than peacefully resigning to fascism then i might feel like they give a shit for once.
Oh my decorum! How precious my decorum is! It’s the most important thing in the universe.
P.S. White people can break decorum anytime they want though like for example using the C word in parliament.
If the rules are so strict how come they waited 5 months to implement the punishment?
Because there’s a process to follow?
A process that takes 5 months and coincides with them not being able to participate in the budget debate? Don’t buy that at all.
Cool.
The reason the process dragged out so long is largely due to the conduct of the party members in question, namely refusing to attend hearings etc.
Do you have a source that says the 5-month delay was caused by that refusal? Because while one of them at least refused to come they did present a response that should have been enough to continue the meetings and not cause a 5-month delay.
Te Pati Maori refused to go before the Privileges Committee but did provide a written response, saying it was appropriate “to rise and haka to express anger and opposition to a subject that is abusive and denigrating”.
Why did they take so long for these members and not the labor member who they already dealt with? Why the delay between those two events? Why did this ruling conservative party have so much trouble with what should have been a simple recommendation? And why did they delay it until now?
You seem to have answered your own question with that quote.
So you have no source that contends that at all then? That’s what I thought.
