But he… wasn’t. He lost the presidency in 1932 to Paul Von Hindenburg (53% to 37%. not even particularly close) who later appointed Hitler under pressure to the channclorship (which was an appointed role) in 1933. Hindenburg died in January of 1934 and Hitler de facto merged the presidency and chancelorship into one office (Fuhrer). The story isn’t “regular people put Hitler in power”, it’s “broken legislative systems are vulnerable to facists”.
broken legislative systems are vulnerable to fascists
Lucky America doesn’t have a broken legislative sys… Oh no
At least we have a good judici…
Fuck.
We can rest easy knowing that the judiciary is subject to checks and b…
God damn it.
We’re toast
No we aren’t. Antifascism was effective at stopping fascism in the US and UK.
it’s “broken legislative systems are vulnerable to facists”.
She would know all about that. Bernie was killing Trump in the polls. Hilary was neck and neck with Trump.
The DNC cast their votes for who was going to General. A winner was announced. Everyone started to go to the announcement and for the only time in DNC history, the announcement was rescinded and everyone was broken up into different groups. Hilary staffers were observed scurrying around between groups. Then everyone was forced to vote again. THEN Hilary was declared the candidate going to General.
It was all live tweeted. It was all loudly publicized, but noone seemed to notice. Noone seemed to care.
Of course she is now going to make a historically inaccurate statement that casts actual democracy in a bad light.
That hag needs to stay under her rock.
I mean, there was a court case…
DNC’s lawyers used the legal defense that they’re a private party and can run anyone they want in the general, and because of that, it doesn’t matter if they influence a primary election.
They flat out said primary elections are just a performative act, and the judge agreed with them.
It’s their party, their candidate, and they only let the people vote as a courtesy.
Our “free” country has been run by two private institutions interested only in their own popularity for over 150 years.
We lose. Everything.
Which is correct if you look at the history of how primaries came to be. Parties simply nominating someone is exactly what used to happen. The first Presidential primaries started in 1901, and they still don’t even happen in every state. Plenty still use the caucus system, where a bunch of insiders (usually local people who have volunteered for the party in some capacity) take off a day from work to decide on a candidate. The caucus system has historically been far more susceptible tampering by powerful interests. It literally was a smoke filled room, and is where that metaphor started.
Primaries aren’t some system enshrined in the Constitution or anything. It’s just how both parties have evolved over time. The general population gets its say in the election later on. The system now is far more democratic than the one that existed 200 years ago (with the caveat that we don’t have to stop with progress here).
Obama would never have gotten the nomination in 2008 if the caucus system was still the norm. The leaders of the party wanted Hillary.
That said, I think this approach would work better if there were more than two viable parties. If you don’t like who the Democrats nominated, look the Green Party or Progressives Party or Send Billionaires to Guillotines Party. If they all put a candidate out there selected by party insiders, that’s fine, just vote in the general for whomever you think is the best out of a wide range of options. It’s far harder for corrupt party insiders to game the system in this scenario–for example, it’d be harder to have a place in all parties and setup the candidates you want so you win no matter what. It’s only a problem because we have exactly two parties that matter. Treating multiple parties as private organizations who can nominate whomever they want under any system they want would be fine.
Obama would never have gotten the nomination in 2008
Nope, Obama dominated the cactus states…
https://www.infoplease.com/us/government/elections/campaign-2008-primary-and-caucus-results
That’s not the only thing you just said that I disagree with, it’s just an objective fact and it’s pretty much what the rest of your comment is based on.
Roll back to where caucus were 100 years ago. Obama would not have won those. That system was more grossly corrupt.
Yeah, if you had said something completely different you might not have been wrong, I agree with that.
But what you did say, is objectively wrong.
Except that I was quite clearly citing historical context in everything.
I actually think I vaguely remember this.
Thanks for reminding me.
Don’t forget that there are many, many appointed superdelegates who each have around 8,000 voting power each.
There were 618 pledges from DNC superdelegates in the 2016 nomination, equaling 4,944,000 voting power (meaning votes equivalent to ~5 million regular voters in the DNC). These are not delegates assigned to states but to specific groups and people in positions in the DNC itself.
For reference, 16,917,853 of the popular vote itself went to Hilary Clinton and 13,210,550 went to Bernie Sanders according to this eye cancer of a website. If all of the DNC superdelegates voted for Bernie Sanders, he would have won the 2016 DNC primaries, even though the DNC voters regardless that the actual regular DNC voters voted for Hilary.
Anyway, I’m only making a point that system was broken.
The DNC did reform this afterwards, in that, if the first ballot doesn’t have an absolute majority then superdelegates will cast votes but otherwise, cannot (as a superdelegate).
Nice rundown.
At the end of the day, I think the United States is just too damn big to run this type of system.
Red states are so entrenched in their beliefs and blue states are so entrenched in theirs, there is no way to cap them off with one cohesive federal government.
By design, every advancement is a crucial blow to the other side.
And then the real rub.
We have been at it long enough that there are not 2 parties. There is one mob of selfish egotistical asshats who struggle and toil keep federal office the best place to get richer and more powerful.
We keep calling it a government divided. IT ISNT. They are of one mind, taking a foot but making sure not to take a yard. Giving up a foot but making sure not to lose a yard. And every time the ball moves one half of The mindless masses feel validated, one half of The mindless masses feel violated, and the whole effort had an earmark on page 1672 of 3000 that assraped EVERYONE except the rich and the politician.
My betting money is on the fact that we will crumble like the USSR before I die. No grand civil war two electric Boogaloo. Just a pathetic crumbling.
The difference between US and the USSR is that we don’t have a pre USA history/culture to fall back on.
Not sure entirely about that. Nazis were still a party that held up to 44% of seats in the reichstag (before they were all nazi) with like 6 different parties. Hitler wasn’t isolated. The population voted for him and his party. Hindenburg didn’t like Hitler but essentially passed away at a terrible time and Hitler outplayed Papen who was meant to keep him in check. Hindenburg felt he had to since they had the closest to a majority in the reichstag.
"In the end, the president, who had previously vowed never to let Hitler become chancellor, appointed Hitler to the post at 11:30 am on 30 January 1933, with Papen as vice-chancellor.[91] While Papen’s intrigues appeared to have brought Hitler into power, the crucial dynamic was in fact provided by the Nazi Party’s electoral support, which made military dictatorship the only alternative to Nazi rule for Hindenburg and his circle. [Sauce]
Yes, there was support in the population, but there was also a lot of violence to suppress dissent. The historical consensus, as I learned it, is to call it the “seizure of power” (“Machtergreifung” in German), because Hitler wasn’t simply voted into power by a majority.
This somewhat misleading, Hitler and the NSDAP were indeed voted into the position to seize power by democratic means which they then abused, the voter supression mainly happened in later elections when the undermining of institutions and the consitution was already well underway. “Machtergreifung” is the propaganda term the Nazis used themselves to describe the process of what happened after the fact, which in reality was much more cloak and dagger-y than the term suggests.
P.S.: Germany didn’t have a two-party system, so having a majority wasn’t that important. You would form coalitions of parties after an election which then had a majority, or even form a minority government that then has to actively hunt for their missing votes from other parties to get any legislation passed.
That is not correct. Neither according to Wikipedia, not to what I learned in school. The term “Machtergreifung” was avoided by the Nazis, they used “Machtübernahme” as to not alienate their moderate conservative supporters. But “Machtergreifung” is much more fitting, when applying it to the process that was started in January 1933.
And yes, Hitler convinced Hindenburg to appoint him as the head of a coalition government, as the NSDAP had lost votes and came in “only” at around 33%. The normal rules of how to govern in a multi-party system don’t quite apply, because it was never Hitler’s goal to rule as part of a coalition, having to compromise.
They used both terms as well as “Machtübergabe” (transfer of power) to refer to Hitler being appointed chancelor, but that was neither the beginning nor the end of the multi-step coup the Nazis enacted, which is what I wanted to highlight. The term makes it seem like a singular event, when in reality it was a longer process.
That’s super interesting. I did not know that
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I get it, but this take fucking worries me, dawg. The last time the Democrats played the “I don’t have to try and appeal to you because the other guy is Hitler, lol” card, ‘Hitler’ won. It’s even a little on the nose that this is coming from Hillary. I’m worried that they’re falling into the same intellectually and politically bankrupt trap as in 2016, that they’re aware that they don’t have a meaningful platform besides “we’re not republicans”, and that they’ve somehow convinced themselves that this is enough. The republicans of 2020 and 22 also had that same absence of platform, absence of appeal, and just trying to coast on party brand, and look where that got them. Shit is on fire, we don’t have time for these dumb fuck games, let alone for Trump to win again. C’mon guys, don’t fuck this up.
They’re always going to fuck up. That’s what they do. Most of them belong in retirement communities yet for whatever reason think they have what it takes to run a government. They’re disconnected from reality yet expect to appeal to regular people, who have to suffer in the reality they’ve created?
Expect more shitshows.
The grassroots efforts are the only reason Dems enjoying their recent victories. Hard-working people who want to see progress. We’d be looking at a red Congress if not for them, and I look forward to when the DNC is irrelevant, too.
When she called them deplorables they ate it up. She just needs to not stick her nose in.
yeah, i came here to post that she is not the person to voice this. anyone currently supporting trump isn’t going to suddenly switch sides to his opponent in the original race, it actually just weakens the argument.
If she’s not going to suck republican voter dick, anything she says, no matter how true right now is only going to do damage. She needs to shut her trap, go back to being irrelevant, and continue to consider herself lucky that she and Bill still never went to jail over Whitewater…
I think even that would just confirm their opinion of her, lol
People don’t like smart women. Especially when they are right. It’s something culturally strange about the US.
I think smart women are great. I assume she’s educated but she is neither wise or likable.
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It’s even a little on the nose that this is coming from Hillary. I’m worried that they’re falling into the same intellectually and politically bankrupt trap as in 2016, that they’re aware that they don’t have a meaningful platform besides “we’re not republicans”, and that they’ve somehow convinced themselves that this is enough.
The irony is that… progressives absolutely do have a solid platform that people generally support. by people, I’m excluding Hilary’s and Biden’s Corporate Donors. Sorry, I don’t have to respect Citizens United.
Biden’s Corporate Donors.
These people must have hated it when Biden created a 15% minimum corporate tax rate.
These people must have hated it when Biden created a 15% minimum corporate tax rate.
If the status quo is any indication, corporate tax rules are largely performative. I would be happy to be wrong about that and see actual enforcement happen as a result of the Inflation Reduction Act, but I’m not gonna hold my breath.
https://itep.org/55-profitable-corporations-zero-corporate-tax/
There is some detailed guidance about the CAMT I found here, but someone with more specific knowledge will have to parse through it to determine how easily they are gonna be able to dodge this, too.
These people must have hated it when Biden created a 15% minimum corporate tax rate.
If the status quo is any indication, corporate tax rules are largely performative.
First of all NO tax increase is ever “performative”. That is a completely meaningless sentence. 2nd, you obviously don’t understand how rare and difficult it is to increase taxes. 3rd, you obviously don’t understand how critical it is to raise taxes on the wealthy.
Did you click through to the first article I linked? I called them performative because corporations just exploit loopholes to avoid paying their dues anyway.
I understand the importance of raising taxes on the wealthy. However, I also understand that those efforts will be meaningless if they aren’t backed up on the enforcement side.
These people must have hated it when Biden created a 15% minimum corporate tax rate. There’s enough loopholes that they didn’t care all that much. It only affects companies that net over a billion dollars in profit to start with, and then there’s the question of… do they actually pay the taxes they currently owe? (answer: they do not.)
It’s not like they were paying the ostensible 12% taxes they owed before.
The entire point of the 15% MINIMUM tax rate is that their are no loopholes around it.
It’s not like they were paying the ostensible 12% taxes they owed before.
You know nothing about taxes. The rate was reduced by Convicted Rapist Treason Trump from 34% to the current 20%.
It’s not Biden’s fault that you don’t understand or pay attention to crucial current events.
You know nothing about taxes. The rate was reduced by Convicted Rapist Treason Trump from 34% to the current 20%. apple’s tax rate the last 3 years, from their '22 10k:
from microsoft’s '23 10k:
Tesls '23 10k:
Do go on about how the current tax is 20%.
now lets talk about the 15%- the biggest and most obvious loop hole is that it only applies to corporations that make more than 1 billion in earnings. Which, is actually relatively few. and if you can’t think of a way around that for the few that are there, then you probably shouldn’t be talking. I can think of a few ways. The easiest is to fork off functional sections into subsidiaries (which then pay their own taxes)
but under no circumstances did Biden do that without his corpo benefactors giving him the go ahead to do so in the first place. Because money is speech and corporations are people… and corporations have a helluvalotta “speech” to give. either to biden or his competitor.
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he was speaking in Congress in favor of abolishing all social safety nets with extreme prejudice
That never happened. You made it up.
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The thing those people don’t understand is that they think democracy is a goal onto itself, instead of a means to an end. A good chunk of the population would happily get rid of democracy in order to have someone in power ‘who can just get stuff done’. Especially since said democracy is ridiculously unresponsive to the will of the people.
Compare the polling on the Gaza conflict compared to what members in the house are saying, for example. Or any other super popular thing (legalising weed, taxing the wealthy, not running a global empire that constantly gets involved in wars,…)
And, for the record, Hillary, Hitler never got over 50% of the vote, it was other, so-called democratic parties that gave him the Chancellor job. They could’ve created a different governing coalition, but they thought they could control him.
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Well, the issue with electing one of those people is that you usually can’t vote them out again. It’s definitely not a good move, but when people are desperate enough and they feel ignored by their representatives, they’ll roll that dice.
It’s not an accident. The country is moving left, and the right-wing Democrats are afraid of losing control of the party. They almost did, twice. They don’t take the “the other guy is Hitler” rhetoric seriously, themselves. They aren’t worried about losing their power if the Republicans win the Whitehouse, or even both branches of Congress, because it’s all one big club, and they won’t be kicked out, as long as they go along to get along, but they are terrified that a leftist rise will take the reigns of the Democratic party from them, and then they really will be out of power.
Dems lose because dems gamble. They always pick some rando as VP instead of the person who got the second most votes in the primary They should’ve gotten rid of the electoral college when Gore lost. They keep running and electing excruciatingly old people who might die or go senile in the middle of everything (Biden, Feinstein, Pelosi, etc.).
They’re gonna fuck it up.
Honestly, I truly believe that both Democratic and Republican politicians benefit from all the bullshittery going on - so of course they’ll actually do nothing to improve the situation for America’s citizens. As long as they get money and they get paid, they’ll say and do whatever the fuck they can, including fucking things up for us.
Probably not much better across the pond, but I am finding myself more and more looking up how to become a UK citizen because at least they have less zany shit going on from what I can tell.
both Democratic and Republican politicians benefit from all the bullshittery going on
They absolutely don’t. They just have a very short term view because of reelection cycles and fundraising needs. You’d think their capitalist masters would also realize this increasing polarization and dissatisfaction with the status quo is going to make the line go down, but nobody ever accused economic liberals of actually being aware when the noose was tightening on their necks.
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I get this, but at the same time, we are also seeing a ton of fallout from those 4 years that’s all currently in the spotlight, which is something we didn’t have in 2016. So despite what she is saying, I think a lot of people are actually seeing the mess, and at least some people are switching sides due to it all. Hoping that the mix of everything really does help next year, last night’s elections were a good sign of it if you ask me but we know they now have a year to pivot and try to change. Thankfully, most of the people in their own party can’t even agree on much either.
Hillary is toxic to the brand. The Democrats would be wise to keep her at arms distance.
It’s a little sad because decades of right-wing anti-Hillary propaganda not only proved effective, but it noticeably altered Hillary into this jaded cynic completely lacking in vision or idealism. I’m not a huge Hillary fan, but the vast majority of the hate is completely manufactured outrage. That being said it doesn’t change what you said being valid.
You can see them trying with AOC, but I suspect it won’t yield the same results.
Dude she was a McGovern girl. She has always been an empty husk seeking power and validation
There’s always been this weird push from her supporters that’s anyone who doesn’t like her is either a misogynist or fell for propaganda.
They just refuse to admit she has any faults.
Those same people are beginning to do that with Kamala too. Thankfully it’s not as widespread yet.
She was a Goldwater Girl, which is orders of magnitude worse. McGovern would have been a massive improvement from Nixon.
She did a good enough job maligning herself, she didn’t need the Republicans to do it for her. The entire DNC primary was a shitshow of Clinton debasing the primaries and showing what she would do for power.
but it noticeably altered Hillary into this jaded cynic completely lacking in vision or idealism
it noticeably altered hillary clinton into hillary clinton
There’s a bunch of stances she’s taken I view negatively but admit there’s nuance.
Then there’s DOMA. Anyone on that let it be known their principles for marginalized groups is only “as convenient”, which means support of them should also only be as is convenient or useful. She is no longer convenient or useful.
Someone couldn’t find a photo of her looking less…Palpatine-y?
You’re welcome to try, but it might take awhile…
I could try wrestling a grizzly bear too but I find it’s better to criticize from a distance.
Give in to your hate. Feel the powah!
I love how most of the comments here are about how much everyone hates Hillary rather than about what she actually said. I get it that people hate her, but let’s be real folks; Trump is the only relevant clear and present danger here. Bitching about Hillary seems pretty pointless at this point.
I hear you. What she said is correct. The thing is, this person is so unlikeable that there’s no way she can help. No matter how sharp you are, or how good of an elected official you’ll be (and I do think she would have been extremely good at her job if she was elected (I did vote for her)), you must have charisma to be effective in politics.
I honestly believe in my heart that if she paid millions for widespread TV ads with her saying “do not vote for Donald Trump” it would help him.
What she said is correct.
But it’s not though. The sentiment is in the right place but she got her facts wrong.
Again, you are focusing on her rather than on what she actually said. That’s what I find so telling and unfortunate. Are we really so shallow and politically inept that we can’t hear a message simply because we dislike the messenger?
It seems like you are telling me yes, that’s exactly how shallow and politically inept we are.
If so, that sucks, especially since you are almost certainly correct.
I am saying that I’m afraid, and I do believe it.
I’m not happy about it either man
Thank you!
Bitching about Hillary is how Trump got elected in the first place.
No, Hillary and the DNC rigging the primary is how trunp got elected in the first place. Bernie would have won.
Rigging the primaries by… adhering to the popular vote. Got it.
No, by ending the primaries early, and by feeding her debate questions in advance, and 15 other things I’ve forgotten by now that we saw proof of in her emails.
A Hillary win would have saved the Supreme Court. Now we are on precarious ground. There was no disadvantage in her winning
Let’s face it - had she won, things would be way better than they are, and we wouldn’t be in the constant fascist danger we are now.
Yep, you can blame the Dems and Clinton herself 100% for that one, given that we know Bernie would have won. She is directly responsible for things being as bad as they are.
given that we know Bernie would have won
You don’t know that at all. You didn’t see the playbook against him.
True, but to pretend the Democrats didn’t actively sabotage their most popular candidate in favor of the “safe” choice… twice… is a stretch.
I voted for Biden. Will vote again.
Voted for Hilary, too.
Not because I wanted to. Democrats don’t seem to want to do much beyond maintain the status quo, at least at the presidential level.
Bernie was not their most popular candidate. This is an internet Fable. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_Democratic_Party_presidential_primaries#Graphical_summary_of_polling
It makes my head spin that people think Bernie lost because he couldn’t overcome the most standard political maneuverings of the Democrats, and yet he would somehow overcome the political maneuverings of the Republican party which plays far dirtier than the Democratic party does. Does everyone forget the Bush Campaign spreading rumors that John McCain’s adopted Bangladeshi daughter was actually an illegitimate Black child from an affair? Or how about when they turned John Kerry’s service in Vietnam into a something he only did for fame?
How the Hillary Clinton campaign deliberately “elevated” Donald Trump with its “pied piper” strategy
Edit: Sorry, downvoters; it is what it is.
An email recently released by the whistleblowing organization WikiLeaks shows how the Clinton campaign and Democratic Party bear direct responsibility for propelling the bigoted billionaire to the White House.
In its self-described “pied piper” strategy, the Clinton campaign proposed intentionally cultivating extreme right-wing presidential candidates, hoping to turn them into the new “mainstream of the Republican Party” in order to try to increase Clinton’s chances of winning.
Ah, the real reason people hate WikiLeaks. It exposed the truth, but rather than focus on the truth people focused on the messenger.
Sadly the republicans had zero say in their slide to right wing extremism and could do nothing about it. It’s not like their flirtation with the Tea Party movement meant anything.
Yup, poor poor Republicans… They don’t actually agree with all the things they say on Facebook or memes they share, or political violence they wish for or enact. Poor Republicans, it was all the evil Democrats that made Republicans be who they are. It’s really a shame that they have absolutely no brain of their own that they just go with whatever the Democrats make them do. We should be lead by that party though, because they’re “free thinkers”
…wait
It exposed the truth, but rather than focus on the truth people focused on the messenger.
In this case, the media also focused on the messenger and gave Hillary a pass on the actual contents of those e-mails.
Shut the fuck up you old hag, you and your party got him elected by running ads supporting him and fucking Bernie in the primaries. Why can’t she just fucking die already
Yeah, I don’t want to see or hear about Hilary Clinton anymore. She pushed her way in and fucking lost to Trump.
The fact that she lost the 2008 primary to Obama (basically unknown at that stage) should’ve been a clue that she’s deeply unpopular and unelectable.
Part of it is because of decades of right wing smears, but part of it is also because she can sound very out of touch at times.
Yep, it fucking sucks that the GOP propaganda machine spent decades convincing people she was Satan in the flesh, but they did, and it was completely bullheaded to think that could be undone. Especially during an election that was clearly taking a populist tone when she had at that point become the face of the establishment for so many. Goddamn it I still can’t believe we’re in this shit timeline
She comes across incredibly inauthentic, like she’s playing a character. A lot of people pick up on that easily, which is why it’s so easy for people to not like her, regardless of her political positions
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Remember when they rigged the primaries and were like “yeah, we can do whatever we want. This isn’t the REAL election yet!” And then they never got court time? Do we really have a choice on who to vote for?
They…literally can, though? The primaries are not part of the election process outlined in the Constitution. They don’t have to have primaries at all.
The DNC and RNC are not government entities, they’re private organizations.
The DNC and RNC are not government entities, they’re private organizations.
Then why the fuck do they get privileged support from the state for their primaries?
The answer is that the process is fucking corrupt, and they need to either actually be treated as the powerless private entities they claim to be (i.e. zero involvement in any elections whatsoever – primaries shouldn’t be a thing, and candidates on the general election ballot shouldn’t even have a party listed next to their name) or they need to be held accountable as the de-facto government entities they are.
Or they need to be destroyed entirely outright; that’s fine too!
For fuck’s sake, even the Republicans can run a fair vote, nobody in the RNC wanted Trump but when they counted the votes, there it was. The DNC couldn’t run a vote properly if the UN sat at the polling stations and scrutinized the polls. The massive fuckery that occurred during her “coronation” was obvious and disgusting.
I mean, they can eschew primaries and just appoint whatever candidate they want. But their voters might not like that.
Not that Democrats have ever given a shit what their voters want.
The best thing Hilary Clinton can do is shut the fuck up and go away
All the negative anti-Hillary comments in this thread aside, please vote responsibly in 2024.
We cannot afford another 2016 situation again.
Tell that to the democratic party that is insisting on putting up a senile old man as their candidate…
Because 2020 under Biden is going so much better…
I dislike Biden for many reasons but he isn’t actively encouraging domestic terrorism, so yeah, I’d say it is. You have to understand your little shitstain set the bar lower than humanly thought possible.
No he’s just directing his DOJ to call anti-apartheid activists anti-Semitic domestic terrorists.
He is, and it’s important to remember, but that’s less harm than Trump would cause on the same issue, nevermind all the other issues.
Trump era had people being pulled off the streets into unmarked black vans, literally the bogeyman they used on name growing up about secret police. It wasn’t better, certainly. My concern, is that on one side they’re actively setting fires that can burn us all down, and on the other now, they’re letting those same fires burn, and it’s still burning people. We still have camps on the border. We still haven’t rolled back to Obama-era Cuba restrictions, we still haven’t seen any effort to lessen police funding and it’s oversized control of the budgets of nearly every city in the country. In fact, we’ve seen further money put into police to further militarize them. We haven’t seen Biden demonizing cop city protestors, but he hasn’t done shit in their favor either. We haven’t seen him putting money into food banks to help with record food insecurity. Nothings happening around housing, and most of us are spending over half our income on just rent.
Like, fuck man. Is the best choice really between active destruction and slow decimation?
No, he’s just actively encouraging genocide, which is totally fine and good with you I presume? People just like you are the reason hitler was able to take power. Nothing trump ever did reached the level of denying and supporting genocide. I’d rather have an idiot in power than a figurehead for very smart and very evil people pulling the strings.
I don’t know if you’ve noticed, but both Biden and Trump are promoting the same genocide. The difference is Biden’s support is quite unfavorable, while Trump’s base is riled up by the prospects of war and killing brown people. Hell, House Republicans are trying to expulse all Palestinians from the country.
Trump is not supporting the genocide to nearly the same degree as Biden. Also, we all know trump is all talk. Bidens words should always be taken more seriously than Trump’s, and Biden is the one capable of taking action. And he hasn’t. Nobody should reasonably expect anything of Trump in 2023, while on the other hand, Biden is the president right now, and has a duty to act. Biden is responsible for the genocide, trump is not.
“You know, I hated losing, and I especially hated losing to him because I had seen so many warning signals during the campaign,” Clinton said.
Oh you did? Then maybe you should have fucking campaigned like you were running against a fascist instead of strolling casually to your inevitable coronation.
While I’m not her fan she is right and this exactly why the current trend on. The internet of voting 3rd party is dangerous, since the Republican are not playing in good faith and they will not split their vote.
No, she is 100% incorrect. Hitler was not elected. He famously staged a coup d’etat.
She’s about 60% incorrect. The nazi party won a majority in the reichstag via normal electoral means before hitler was appointed chancellor by then-president Paul von Hindenburg. It was only after a series of electoral victories and in the anticommunist bloodlust that followed the reichstag fire that a state of emergency was declared and the coup began in earnest. I’ll give her that she’s mostly wrong because what she literally said is untrue, but because it’s an oversimplification of what happened and her broader point, that nazis used electoralism before they used brute force, is true.
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What are you talking about Republicans split votes with libertarianism all the time, like constantly
Not really. Libertarian and green turnout has been down since Trump/Hillary. Apparently having two terrible candidates makes everyone a tactical voter.
I don’t understand what you mean, we recently saw some of the biggest percentages for libertarians, like the last president vote in 2020, or even 2016, I recall like 3% PR something. Basically the biggest weve seen in a while. I think Democrats are way more likely to not split. Most conservatives I know say they’d vote libertarian if it didn’t feel like a throw away vote too
You’re right, I was thinking of 16 to 20.
Can’t tell if you were talking about Clinton and Trump or Johnson and Stein. Trump and Stein were the worst two. I’m not convinced shes not a literal Russian plant, and if not she’s a useful idiot for sure. Johnson wasn’t even as good as his running mate, but that party is a joke anyway.
Republican are playing in good faith
How exactly?
and they will not split their vote.
I wouldn’t hold my breath on that one as they’re fully into leopards ate my face land at this point.
Missed a the word “not”
Oh hah gotcha, right on man.
Yes people should vote for Biden over Trump, because Trump is the biggest threat of our lifetime. But instead of policing people online whenever Biden makes shit policy choices, maybe spend that energy pressuring Joe into doing things voters care about.
It’s like we all fear Biden is giving up, continuing his on his strategy of alienating voters and liberals want anyone to blame it on besides Biden.
Giving up? What are you talking about? Dude is out there everyday busting ass.
Busting ass every day? In 21-22 yes, but not lately.
Talk to marginally engaged voters about Biden, they are either going to make or break him in 2024. And right now, they feel like he is not representing them.
Yea, let’s go back to the guy that’s juggling a half dozen criminal court cases, and tried to overthrow the government, and is more likely to take away my right to vote entirely instead of being mildly annoyed at Joe Biden.
WTH are you talking about? My top comment is the opposite of that. And Biden arming a genocide has many Democrats light years beyond annoyed.
I swear if liberals put their energy pushing for popular policies instead of policing any criticism of Biden, his positions and polls numbers would flip.
Stop enabling Genocide Joe, because Genocide Joe is how we get Trump again.
It’s an extremely complicated situation, and I have no desire to waste my time with someone using tabloid nicknames to get their point across. Biden doesn’t do his work via Twitter. We’re talking about an upcoming election against a traitor who flip flops on the issue depending on what gets him more press. You think Biden not stopping Israel is genocide, what do you think an authoritarian dictator loving leader of a party of xenophobic Trans hating extremists is going to do?
Genocide is not complicated, it is never acceptable.
I’d like to say Trump would be too stupid to pull off a Hitler but the more I learn about Hitler the more I learn that he was by no means a bright man.
What you mean someone who wraps up their entire identity into hating minorities is a moron?
No, really?
I predicted in the 2016 primaries that if HRC became the Dem nominee, it would be the one thing the Right Wing in America could unify itself against- they hated her then and they still do today; I wonder if she realizes yet how big a gift it is to a splintered, ungovernable mob of political grifters to give it anything they can unify against
It was the most tragic thing when Bernie was pushed aside in favour of H.Clinton, who polled very poorly.
With due respect, it is time for Hillary Clinton to be taken less seriously. Look at who she let win the presidency? A dynamic candidate that could connect with more voters could have flattened Trump. She came across as arrogant and entitled. She is a shrewd and intelligent person, but clearly disconnected from most normal concerns.
Look at who she let win the presidency?
She got more votes - the American voters literally preferred her but the electoral college does mean some votes are effectively worth more than others.
All these people thinking that she was too dumb to beat Trump also must assume that she created the electoral college. I’m at a total loss on a lot of comments in this thread.
The electoral college is not the only reason she lost, though?
She could have gotten more votes had she not been a crappy candidate, evidence of her being so is in other comment on this thread
All these people thinking that she was too dumb to beat Trump also must assume that she created the electoral college.
Or that she was too steeped in hubris to take it into account and campaign accordingly.
Why are things Hilly say relevant?
She is a former First Lady. Americans tend to listen to their first ladies when they choose to speak out, at least as much as any other celebrity. I remembering hearing plenty over the years from Lady Bird Johnson or Barbara Bush after they time in the White House was over. Hillary was also directly involved in politics after her time as First Lady, so i would think we would pay more attention to her when she speaks in that arena.
She was also Secretary of State under Obama.
She is (or at least one of) the head of a massive informal organization that bridges massive formal organizations like Emily’s List, Planned Parenthood, the DNC itself, and so on.
When a president wins an election for example, they have to get their staff from somewhere right? There has to be large numbers of people who can just drop what they’re doing based on the outcome of an election and spend the next several years doing that instead. These people staff NGOs in the orbit of the political ruling classes of these parties. Hillary Clinton is one of the most powerful people in the country because she can decide who gets the best jobs in these organizations. She can get journalists fired, she can get ambassadors hired. That’s her power.
Obama beat her and still had to deal with her to the point of setting her up to run in 2016. She didn’t join his organization he became a ‘board member’ of hers with a small cadre of his own people.
