You know, like McDowells. I don’t actually care what color my shells are. There are principals involved. Principalities!
The Wii is still a good platform
The Mario part. You can copy the Kart part all day. They’ve been doing so since at least the 64. See:
-
Diddy Kong Racing
-
Crash Team Racing
-
Burger King Pocketbike Racer
No love for Street Racer? I don’t blame you.
Let’s not forget SuperTuxKart!
I’ll never fucking forgive y’all for leaving out Dr Robotnik’s Ring Racers (FOSS sonic fangame)
Skunny Kart was my favourite, mostly because it was by a group called “CopySoft”
Wacky Wheels!
-
The world needs wacky wheels again
Instantly got the main menu theme in my head.
It was an awesome game, but now I get headache from the fast moving low pixel graphics. I would definitely play it again with a few pixels more.
Basically every kind of game needs a “MUGEN” for that genre. Then we just put in the content we want and theme it appropriately.
Does SuperTuxKart fit the bill?
It does; you can add karts, racers, and maps
It’s crazy this hasn’t happened yet. Kart racers are conceptually very simple games and are all very similar. CTGP kinda does this but is limited by Mario Kart’s engine.
Right? A series of adjustable physics inputs, a way to import levels and tag areas with terrain info that’s defined in a file somewhere… Typing it out? I think it’s wild that it happened to fighting games BEFORE it happened to a lot of other genres.
Haven’t seen Dr Robotnik’s Ring Racers mentioned yet. Open source game based on the Freedoom engine.
Edit: Some salty commenters here. This isn’t my graph, just one I grabbed. Notes aren’t mine.
I’m a huge proponent for inflation adjusted livable minimum wage- which should be close to $30 an hour these days. Also hugely worried about our housing cost trends.
I’m only pointing out that expecting games to cost 40-60 for life is a little silly- yall still paying $.10 for a loaf of bread? I remember when games inched from $40 to $60 and everyone lost their minds- no one complains about it anymore. Don’t wanna pay retail? Wait for sales, bundles, used copies.
To your edit: Exactly! The only problematic trend I see is that physical copies are getting more scrace.
Okay, but now do housing and groceries and you’ll see why people don’t have extra money laying around for another Nintendo and its Mario kart.
Economics is significantly more complicated than a bar graph of inflation-adjusted video game price tags lol. Hell, even just value of each game in their respective release time period is more complicated than that. I doubt there’s anything unique to this new game (other racing games have done the open world thing several times starting like 15 years ago), but the kart racer genre itself was new back in the 90s.
In fairness here, it’s not Nintendo’s fault we let landlords gobble up all our spare money.
Maybe they need to send Luigi to have a word.
This is a valuable way of seeing how prices have changed in different ways for different categories, just since 2000.
Why are TV’s listed as “100% cheaper”? I’m a little confused about that number.
Looking up the source, they state: “At the turn of the century, a flat screen TV would cost around 17% of the median income of the time ($42,148). In the early aughts though, prices began to fall quickly. Today, a new TV will cost less than 1% of the U.S. median income ($54,132).”
So a Flat screen TV used to cost around $7165, and does now cost around $541, which is about 7.5% of the original value. That means a deflation by 92.5%.
Okay, but now do housing and groceries and you’ll see why people don’t have extra money laying around for another Nintendo and its Mario kart.
Okay. So, they won’t buy one then.
Yeah, people don’t make enough money, I agree.Housing and groceries are part of the inflation…
Edit: seems the previous line might not apply to the US because insanity.
The real issue is that inflation only accounts hire much more things cost, but not the trend on salaries. If salaries and costs follow the same slope, you’re “even”. The problem is when costs increase at a faster rate than income.
Groceries (and energy costs) were excluded from inflation in the 1970s as politicians decided that they were “too volatile”.
My bad, I tried to use a logical definition of inflation in a logical country. They are definitely considered in my country.
If the biggest costs of living are not considered in the metric for cost of living increase, WTF.
I’ll update my comment
Yeah, it’s fuckery all the way down here in America.
Edit: these notes have been addressed in OP’s post
Note: Salary growth has outpaced inflation.
You know what else has outpaced inflation? The cost of living. Purchasing power for middle and lower class people is far less than what it used to be. “Inflation” doesn’t account for that.
Nintendo games never go on sale. And if somebody buys a Switch game, dumps the ROM, and sells it to you, your Nintendo account gets banned because the ID in the header matches the one being distributed over the Internet.
this argument is so fucking dumb
Volume of video game sales has changed monstrously over the years as it moved from a niche hobby to mainstream
SNES Mario kart - 8.76 million copies sold worldwide Switch Mario kart 8 - 67.34 million copies sold world wide.
SNES mario kart (inflation adjusted) earnings - 1,095,000,000 Switch Mario kart earnings - 5,252,520,000
Game dev budgets have obviously exploded in that time and nintendo doesn’t disclose their budgets but on average its estimated snes titles got about 1-2 million and switch/wii u titles got 30ish million. That’s a sizable increase in development that wildly outpaces inflation, for sure, but their earnings obviously did too.
Also, people tend not to account for manufacturing drops. Cost to produce dropped dramatically when things moved from cartridges to optical formats. Dropped somewhat in the move to digital distribution, though not as much as you might think.
Removing significant printed instruction manuals helped, too. Printing has gotten really expensive over the last 30 years. Falcon 4.0 came with a spiral bound book written by an actual F-16 pilot, and it was basically an F-16 flight manual. Nobody expects that to ever happen again. Not with a base game, anyway. That game was about $53 at launch (going by the “Chips and Bits” ad toward the back of this old CGW magazine).
There’s a good $20-30 in reduced production costs that were never directly passed on to customers.
Snes carts were $20-60 not including license fees without the game. They also had a 100% markup at retail. Small 8GB switch carts are about $10 with $12, including licensing, and have a 40% markup. The take home for a publisher was $2-5 for snes and should be $18 for a switch game on the small cart on $60 at retail. Digital take home is $40. Comparing the take home price for the consumer is disingenuous. It is especially bad when we are not comparing to Gameboy and includes optical media when it is essentially free with the box.
The publishers are getting a minimum 9x more take home now on the expensive switch carts and licensing. Thr wiiu and ps4 were more like 11-12x with the ps5 and digital switch games even more. Those far outback inflation and even outback the increase in dev costs most of the time.
Because they… sold more copies?
yes obviously
your pricing is higher when volume of sales is lower because you have to cover overheads and still make a profit.
When volume is significantly higher the pricing can be lower. You can still cover your overheads because even though you make less money per unit, you overall still can make the same amount (or in this case, 5x as much) because of the increased sales volume
The “need to increase prices” is motivated by several factors like a weak yen and remaining fear from the commercial failure of the Wii U but it’s primarily greed and hostility to consumers. Mario kart is the most successful nintendo game so it is not fair to use it solely as the metric but it is also not as if their other games all suffer and that they don’t make shitloads of cash; 11 billion last year and 12 billion the year before.
And those numbers don’t include companies that are commonly associated with by divested from nintendo like the Pokémon company, which made another 1.9 billion on top of that last year. And unlike many western AAA developers their development costs appear to be far more controlled, with estimates of 20-30 million per game vs something like Spider-Man 2 for the ps5, which was over 10x that at 315 million. According to the leaks the first Spider-Man game cost over 100 million to make and made 827 million back.
Games are also much easier to distribute now than they ever where, saving cost.
True- but they cost like 1000x more to develop too.
Maybe not 1000x more, but that’s fair too.
The cost ceiling for AAA games has increased, but no I’d say considering advancements in game engines and the power of personal computers the floor has never been cheaper (1 person can make a game in their free time for $0, even 3D).
If any were to embrace the lower-end(/minimalism, proven older techniques) you’d think it’d be this company, but now their releases are “only” 10-20GiB.
There’s no reason the market has to do that. We’ve all collectively decided that every generation should have MORE, but the best games I’ve played in recent years are done by small teams looking to provide a good experience in a somewhat limited package.
But isn’t it easier if I just ignore the nuance of economics and just place all the blame for my unhappiness on corporate greed?
I think it’d also be interesting to see the total production cost of each Mario Kart, and a total sales/revenue generated by each game.
I don’t see Diddy Kong Racing on there which is really the only one you need anyway.
Diddy Kong Racing is the GOAT
Crash Team Racing Nitro-Fueled: A remaster of the classic
PlayStation kart racer, featuring Crash Bandicoot and his friends.
Sonic & All-Stars Racing Transformed: Characters from SEGA franchises race in vehicles that transform into boats and planes.
Diddy Kong Racing: Race with Diddy Kong and his friends in karts, planes and hovercraft.
Team Sonic Racing: A kart racer where you work together in teams, using team moves and ultimate abilities.
Nickelodeon Kart Racers Series: Features characters from various Nickelodeon shows.
Disney Speedstorm: A kart racer featuring characters from Disney and Pixar franchises.
KartRider: Drift: A free-to-play kart racer with a focus on drifting.
Lego Racers: Build and race Lego vehicles on various tracks.
Garfield Kart Furious Racing: Race as Garfield and his friends on themed tracks.
Konami Krazy Racers: Race as characters from Konami’s popular franchises.
Blur: Combines arcade racing with vehicular combat and power-ups.
ModNation Racers: Features track creation and customization.
LittleBigPlanet Karting: Brings the creativity of LittleBigPlanet into a kart racing experience.
F1 Race Stars: A more arcade-style take on Formula 1 racing.
SuperTuxKart: An open-source kart racing game.
Starlit Kart Racing: A free-to-play kart racer with a variety of game modes.
Out of curiosity: did you partly use AI to make this list? Some of the short descriptions read very oddly for a forum post, e.g. the “various tracks” part on Lego Racers.
The “And his friends” seems like ai to me too. Not a huge deal since its just a quick aggregated list, but still fun to try and spot
Yes, those two and the LBP one are what got my sensor to go off.
I’m not trying to make a drama out of it (although some people might), I was really just curious if my intuition was correct. I also don’t think it’s all AI because they used a , instead of a : on the second item, and LLMs tend to be way better than that at consistent formatting.
honestly if I was op I wouldn’t respond to that question regardless if AI was(or wasn’t) used, the “did you use AI question” very easily falls into a slippery slope where others hop on and harrass people over it, so it’s easier to just ignore the question.
I would. And then I would use AI to argue with em lol.
You forgot Forza Horizon, which is the only other racing game series with Open World.
Konami Krazy Racers
I wonder why they didn’t got for something like “Konami Krazy Karting”
Too similar to Kuru Kuru Kururin.
They could stack the type then allign it to the left!
You have the best list here, but you forgot Wipeout series. Futuristic racing with weapons, set to electronic music.
Crash Team Racing PS1 was IMHO better than Mario Kart N64. The wumpa fruit added a neat dimension, and the ability to select weapons for battle mode was great.
It still is. Mario Kart is third best behind CTR and Sonic Transformed.
Garfield Kart is the shiiiiiiiit
Make sure you put two line breaks between every new line. Otherwise it kinda comes out as a blob. You can also use a dash and a space before each entry to get a bullet point.
Played a copy of Crash Team Racing a bit ago. Had a real good time with it.
There’s a third Sonic racing game called Sonic and SEGA All Stars Racing.
Party animals has an almost 1:1 in terms of gameplay ripoff of Mario kart
Not quite a clone, but Crash Tag Team Racing was a staple of my childhood
This anti Nintendo thing is a bit much. Especially when every other game company out there has games that cost $150+
I’m anti-nintendo because of the exclusivity, pricing strategy of their hardware, and prison labor, personally.
Base games? No, they do not. This isn’t some “special edition” or whatnot where there’s a cheaper option available, it’s the base version of a game.
Anyone who doesn’t consider the full game (highest tier) to be the base game is too young to remember when the base game was everything
What you consider the base tier is just the demo version
Yes, often times the base game is just the entry fee, but the point is you don’t HAVE to pay more to experience the game. In Mario Kart World’s case? $80 for the entry fee, and you know they’re gonna pile DLC on top of that later. When the Switch 3 comes out for $750 in 2033, Mario Kart World will be $105 for the Switch 2 game + DLC version and $115 for the Switch 3 + DLC version.
Yes they do. I just went on steam and there’s a shit load of games that are that price. Xbox does it, Nintendo does it, PlayStation does it. Yes it sucks, and I can also admit we’ve been lucky, games used to $80 30 years ago, and if they had kept up with the rest of the world they would all be $300+ now
Who’s gonna tell 'em about Indie games. Terraria’s 10 bucks on Steam and GoG.
And $30 for the Switch!
Is it possible you’re not talking about USD? Otherwise I have literally no idea what drugs you’re taking.
Can you provide links to, say 5 different games who’s base price without dlc is $150?
Da fuck is this a homework assignment? For someone who will just ignore anything I post anyways?
It’s a “you’re full of shit but I’ll be polite and just ask you to prove what you’re saying instead of jumping right to calling you out directly”.
Lmao can’t provide proof when called out. Cmon show me all the EA, Activision, Bethesda, Ubisoft, Square Enix, From soft, Cdpr, etc titles with a base price of $150. This should be easy since everyone’s doing it.
Ok if links to 5 is too much work, can you name one or two examples, without the links? We can all Google here.
I’d accept even one example of a new base game being sold at a price higher than $70 US (before Mario Kart World), because I know it doesn’t exist.
If I’m not mistaken, a large component of Nintendo’s power comes from Japanese copyright laws being far more pro-copyright holder and Nintendo uses it to its full potential. In Japan, this sometimes results in prison sentences and often big fines. it’s also applied outside the country against a consortium of universal copyright recognizing countries and so it can affect you regardless of your location although I forget how exactly.
To @[email protected] 's point, perhaps it is the weak qualifications for Japanese patents which have allowed Nintendo to bully everyone.
Japan’s copyright laws are basically the same as everyone else.
Except since in japan you can patent basically everything, the application is much stricter. See how nintendo has patents for “capturing a monster using a ball” and other general stuff.
IIRC, there was a japanese company (capcom, maybe?) that had a patent on showing shadows of the characters when they weren’t visible on screen due to a wall or tree covering them.
How were they able to sue Palworld, then?
Inb4 Tux Racer
Super Tux Kart
Also, Sonic Robo Blast 2 Kart
Or the sequel, Doctor Robotnik’s Ring Racers
If you wanted to make a Mario Kart clone, copyright is easy enough to avoid. Nearly every other second-rate dev studio has managed to make a half-baked Mario Kart ripoff for whatever Nick Jr show they got the licensing to, so that part’s simple.
The real issue is navigating the patent minefield that Nintendo has laid out.
Sonic and All-Stars Racing Transformed is oddly slept on. Great kart racer.
Break out DOSBox and fire up Wacky Wheels from Apogee
… Not particularly more recently there was a Crash Team Racing remake
Honestly coming up blank for anything else recentish in that genre
Ah, Wacky Wheels. Played that so much with my little brother. Good memories.
Give DOSBox-X a try btw. DOSBox development became pretty stagnant unfortunately.
When I read this I thought about whacky wheels, but could not remember the name, thanks!
Wacky wheels was my jam
Bought it for €40
